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Why does Ricky Nelson sound so good?




 
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Author Topic: Why does Ricky Nelson sound so good?  (Read 23599 times)
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WA3VJB
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« Reply #25 on: June 15, 2006, 09:09:42 AM »

Eric Burdon and the Animals have some flange in "Sky Pilot," too.
And the bagpipe battlefield scene in the extended version dramatically pans from left to right.

And, does anyone know how they did the revolving drum kit solo in the song Inna Gadda da Vita, by Iron Butterfly ?

I really envisioned a platform spinning slowly with the drummer riding it, set of stereo mics.  But it actually might have been a flange-based trick of some kind, having thought about it.

Best solo I've heard. Usually those drum bridges are tedious, self-aggrandizing exercises that end up sounding more like someone throwing their kitchen pots and pans down a flight of stairs.





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Jim, W5JO
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« Reply #26 on: June 15, 2006, 10:57:26 AM »


And, does anyone know how they did the revolving drum kit solo in the song Inna Gadda da Vita, by Iron Butterfly ?

Aha, Inna Gadda da Vita by Iron Butterfly.  Here are the lyrics and the original artist name
Garden of Eden
Joe Valino

When you walk in the garden
In the Garden of Eden
With a beautiful woman
And you know how you care
And the voice in the garden
In the Garden of Eden
Tells you she is forbidden
Can you leave her there

When you're yearnin' for lovin'
And she touches your hand
And your heart starts to poundin'
And you're feeling so grand
Can you lead her to heaven
And obey the command
Can you walk from the garden
Does your heart understand

When you walk in the garden
In the Garden of Eden
With a beautiful woman
And you know how you care
And a voice in the garden
In the Garden of Eden
Tells you she is forbidden
Can you leave her there

When you're yearnin' for lovin'
And she touches your hand
And your heart starts to poundin'
And you're feeling so grand
Can you lead her to heaven
And obey the command
Can you walk from the garden
Does your heart understand

When you walk in the garden
In the Garden of Eden
With a beautiful woman
And you know how you care
And the voice in the garden
In the Garden of Eden
Can't you see it's forbidden
Can you leave her there
Can you leave her there
Can you leave her there

Can you leave her there
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K1JJ
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« Reply #27 on: June 15, 2006, 11:04:36 AM »

Record flanging was fun too, you're right, but I wonder how you determined for that guy who wanted them duplicated  the rate of the cancellation. There's a certain art to picking where the null hits, you know. Otherwise it can be a mess.


Paul,

I didn't do the actual recording job - the owner of the studio did. I was just a technician who built custom mixer boards for clients at the time.

What I remember is the guy came in with a pile of records and wanted them flanged onto 8-track cassettes for his car! I could see he was smiling when he came in later to pick them up, so everything must have gone well. The owner later told me he simply monitored the mix and speeded up or slowed down the second turntable to generate the maximum flanging on the fly. Rather unscientific, but that's what he did for the custmer... Grin

I can imagine a good, successful mix would sound something like the random, trippy 160M Lorain sound.

T
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WA3VJB
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« Reply #28 on: June 15, 2006, 01:39:24 PM »

YEAH, remember LORAN ? Sounded like a multi-engine propeller plane.

Lacking any really good drugs, I remember a kid down the street took speaker leads and scotch-taped them to a couple of coins, and then taped the coins to his temples to "feel" the sound of LORAN.


That's impressive.


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Ed KB1HVS
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« Reply #29 on: June 15, 2006, 03:54:10 PM »

Eric Burdon and the Animals have some flange in "Sky Pilot," too.
And the bagpipe battlefield scene in the extended version dramatically pans from left to right.

And, does anyone know how they did the revolving drum kit solo in the song Inna Gadda da Vita, by Iron Butterfly ?

I really envisioned a platform spinning slowly with the drummer riding it, set of stereo mics.  But it actually might have been a flange-based trick of some kind, having thought about it.

Best solo I've heard. Usually those drum bridges are tedious, self-aggrandizing exercises that end up sounding more like someone throwing their kitchen pots and pans down a flight of stairs.







 And Sky Pilot yep!  Inna Gadda da Vita dums? Maybe Roto Toms?
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W9AD
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« Reply #30 on: June 15, 2006, 04:02:11 PM »

Hi Paul,
The old 3M machines really worked well for that flanging effect. With 2 machines outputs mixed equally just pushing your thumb on one or the other of those big fat capstans would give you quite a deep and very controllable effect.
Dave
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Dave W9AD
WA3VJB
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« Reply #31 on: June 15, 2006, 06:35:43 PM »

Hey Dave !
I'm thinking you mean the AMPEX open reel machines, the 300s with the tape lift gate?
3M made cart machines (I have a PD II on loan to Nick KG2IR), but I don't think you could easily get to the capstans on them while underway.

Open reel lent itself very well to flanging, especially as vari-speed came in on some of the pro-decks with DC motors (MCI, Otari, Studer).

There's a song by Boston called Smokin' that has a Hammond B3 in it. Normally that organ has no pitch control, but in the song, it zooms UP in speed, apparently recorded such that when it came "time," they put their thumb on the reel to slow the tape down.

On playback at standard speed it of course sped up.

Cool effect, took us forever to figure out how they did it.

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flintstone mop
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« Reply #32 on: June 15, 2006, 06:55:59 PM »

I looked on the WEB...........and THEY say that Flanging does have that Phasing sound...........I thought that flanging was more of a metallic distortion.  Oh Well
Another .02 cents worth

Fred
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Fred KC4MOP
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Don
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« Reply #33 on: June 15, 2006, 07:01:08 PM »

The NPR gurus had a weird segment on why we are wired genetically to respond to some human voices more than others. The example given was Mick Jagger!

I watched part of his performance at the superbowl halftime this year.

Seems to me that he has developed a speech impediment.  When he sang the song "Satisfaction" he pronounced the words "I cain't get no satisfaction... and I've twied, and I've twied...

I don't remember it sounding that way in the original recording.
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« Reply #34 on: June 15, 2006, 07:59:19 PM »

3M M56 & M79 series reel to reel recorders. M79 went up to 24 trk
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Dave W9AD
WA3VJB
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« Reply #35 on: June 15, 2006, 08:55:42 PM »

AH ! 
I forgot about those machines, Dave, of course.


I did a search -- M56 and M79 -- to remind me. I didn't do much multitrack work, that's what.

But what also came up -- the WOLLENSAK !!!

For that matter, didn't 3M buy the Wollensak line that we used to have in public school?
Wollensak was a white lid, then when 3M came in they changed it to green, added AVC, and kept it rolling another few years before analog hissettes came in and no one had to "learn" how to thread a tape.




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Jim, W5JO
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« Reply #36 on: June 16, 2006, 08:24:07 AM »

Wallensak was a staple of the smaller radio stations.  Good audio and relatively easy with which to work.  You would tape Paul Harvey at 11:05 for playback at 12 noon and other fine chores.
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Steve - WB3HUZ
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« Reply #37 on: June 16, 2006, 11:05:59 AM »

Les Paul did all that stuff before most of these guys your are talking about were born.
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kc2ifr
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« Reply #38 on: June 16, 2006, 11:26:39 AM »

When I worked at Bell Sound Recording Studios back in the late 60's we would drive one of the tape decks with a 100watt audio amp using the 100 volt output. We then drove the input of the amp with an audio generator.To achive the desired phasing effect we would then vary the frequency of the audio generator back and forth around 60 cycles. This would vary the speed of the capstan motor and achived the desired phasing effect. This was much better than "riding the rim" of the tape reels.
BTW...the audio amp only powered the capstan motor....not the whole deck.
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Ed Nesselroad
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« Reply #39 on: June 16, 2006, 11:25:47 PM »

Flanging tangents notwithstanding, the reason Rick sounds so good on your car speakers is that Phil Spector "secret" of mixing to small speakers...the kind found in cars and tabletop radios.  Take the big studio JBLs and Altec Lansings out of the line and patch in the little fellows.  Rick sounds great.  Today's production values are way too hip for that old school stuff.  That's the Big Hurt. 
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kc2ifr
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« Reply #40 on: June 17, 2006, 08:31:25 AM »

Very true Ed....after the final mix, we used to listen to the material on a pair of small 6 inch speakers. In those days most of the pop music WAS listened to on small speakers.
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