Codeless Amateur Radio - Feb. 23, 2007

[W3SLK]

Steve said:

We will never be able to afford the state of the art technologies. The bleeding edge is always expensive and amateur radio has always been well behind it. Just the way it is.

Its a shame. History demonstrated that the amatuers were the leading edge in radio's hay-day. We as a society (hams in general) became complacent and let the someone else dictate our future.

[K1MVP]

Lots of good comments,--on this both "pro and con", and only time will tell,
IMO.
I agree with mosltly with Bruce,--W1UJR.
Do not believe cw HAD to be "retained", BUT, they could have at least
required a "beef-up" of the written exams, like they did in Great Britain
.
In the interim,--I also agree with "Slab Bacon",--its IS a "done deal" and
onward we go, good or bad.

Frankly,I  am tired of discussing this issue,--I spoke out,(both on forums and
with FCC) for all the good it did.(which is questionable)

"P and moaning" at this point, is useless.--I agree.

                                   73, K1MVP
p.s, time to "break out the wick"--CW here I come, along with finishing
      up homebrew projects.
                                 

[K3ZS]

I just wish that the FCC would have just renamed the license class when they lowered it to 5 WPM.    They could have just eliminated the old Extra class for new licensees as they did with the Advanced.   At least those that had got the Extra when it was harder wouldn't have been cheated out of their accomplishment and pride.    Although its a done deal, I thank the FCC for making 80 meters useful again to those of us not owning a frequency on the band.

[wa1knx]

nocoders can always learn the code if they feel uncomfortable with us
aledged "real" hams, but a better reason would be to enjoy a pleasurable
facet of the hobby. i'ts 30 years since i got my extra, not really a cw
guy but do have several cw contacts a year. i find it the most relaxing
thing i do in the hobby, and remember the days of fun fun fun i had
as a novice, and still do now.

[KB2WIG]

  The FIA can be used against the momorization of answers.  Suppose there is a question dealing with a  class a audio amp. Give the diagram,  voltage divider bias, swamped emitter, load resistance on the collector. One could generate  a range of Vcc, and resistor values for the components.  ?? What is the bias voltage on the Base??   given a range of 0 volts to 600 volts generates 600 question answers to memorize for this one problem... Input Z? emitter current?     ( plate resistance? well I can dream , cant' I)??  A few technical problems, Like OHMs law..... using the same format... memorize the color code and give them a resistor.       KLC...

[Joe Long]

Whats an emitter?

[Steve - WB3HUZ]

History demonstrated that the amatuers were the leading edge in radio's hay-day.

May be true, depending on what time period you consider the hey day. I think amateur radio pretty much always been behind the state of the art, but most certainly since WWII. The combination of the huge leap in technology because of the war effort and the period of no amateur activity during the war, put amateur radio behind the curve. It has never caught up.

[k4kyv]

That was true even in the "old days."  Crystal control was first developed about 1926 if I recall correctly.  But hams didn't start using it to any great extent until well into the 30's.  Same with class-B audio amplification to plate modulate a transmitter.  Class B audio was first described in the late 20's, but the first amateur Class B modulation article appeared in about 1933.

Amateurs may have had a hand in the initial development of the single-signal superhet, the standard radio for many years with 1 or 2 rf stages, mixer with or without separate oscillator tube, followed by a couple of 455 kc/s i.f. stages, with diode detector and a couple of audio stages.  There are some articles in early 30's QST describing the prototype built at ARRL labs.

I knew personally the technician who actually put that first set together and wired it.  He later worked in Louisville and lived in southern Indiana.  His name was Bob Parmentier, and his call was W9WT (now SK).

It wasn't long after the QST articles before National released the HRO, which was originally designed for aircraft communication service, but National saw an additional market in the amateur radio community, so they manufactured the special coil sets with bandspread capability on the 80, 40, 20 and 10m bands and began marketing the HRO as a top-of-the-line reciever to hams who could afford it, at over $200 in the middle of the Great Depression.  Other receivers soon followed both for commercial and amateur use.  This may have also been a factor in the universal acceptance of 455 kc/s as the i.f.  Superhets built prior to about 1934 had if's ranging anywhere from 175 kc/s to well above 455 kc/s.

Amateur slopbucket was anything but cutting edge technology.  The principles of SSB were well known by about 1920, and it was used in the early 20's for transatlantic telephone links.  There was some mention of SSB in QST in the mid 30's, and supposedly sometime about 1935 about a half dozen hams were using it on the air. It took till the late 50's for it to become widely available to hams.

[Pete, WA2CWA]

ARRL's, Dave Sumner, steps up and makes his pitch about the current FCC's "code testing going away" ruling:

http://www.remote.arrl.org/news/features/2007/02/01/1/?nc=1

[wa1knx]

just noticed the datetime clock is messed up, i read feb 23, my clock says
feb 1  (?)

[Pete, WA2CWA]

just noticed the datetime clock is messed up, i read feb 23, my clock says
feb 1  (?)

If you're talking about the date in the title, that's when "no code testing" and some other FCC changes  becomes effective.

[W1RC]

There are a lot of comments regarding this subject but we must understand the following if we are going to accept the eventuality of the "code-free" licencing.  Answer the following questions:

Total number of amateur radio licences is:       increasing   decreasing.

Average age of the radio amateur radio licensee is:   increasing   decreasing.

Value of the radio spectrum especially for VHF/UHF frequencies is:  increasing   decreasing.

Number of young people (under age 40) at hamfesters and flea markets is:  increasing   decreasing.

Do the math.

73,

W1RC

[K5MO]

ARRL's, Dave Sumner, steps up and makes his pitch about the current FCC's "code testing going away" ruling:

http://www.remote.arrl.org/news/features/2007/02/01/1/?nc=1

Sumner's not worth reading. He's more interested in his continued salary than HR .

IMHO
John
K5MO

[Pete, WA2CWA]

ARRL's, Dave Sumner, steps up and makes his pitch about the current FCC's "code testing going away" ruling:

http://www.remote.arrl.org/news/features/2007/02/01/1/?nc=1

Sumner's not worth reading. He's more interested in his continued salary than HR .

IMHO
John
K5MO

I would wonder about his sanity if he didn't; Unless one likes to work 40 hours a week and not get paid.

[W9AD]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tq9UsrmkxTY&eurl

[N3DRB The Derb]

In favor of code free licensing since 1982. Nice to see it, and I say, as I always have: F morse mode. It did nothing except give old buzzards a false sense of superiority.

[ab4en]

So after we load up the bands with no-coders just in favor of numbers won't it be interesting to hear these no talent bums try to decipher an sos in morse code on one of the ham bands?!! 

So what will we dispense with next to attract more into the ham faternity?  Perhaps the FCC will make the AM mode illegal so the potential no coder won't be annoyed by the heterodynes?  Perhaps we can eliminate all theory because certainly no one in this modern era will want to homebrew much less troubleshoot their rice boxes.  Better yet - homebrewing should be illegal too.  You'll have to have a license to troubleshoot those rice boxes now.  More regulations to regulate the unregulated mass of  cess pool that the FCC has created with no code.  Hey it all makes sense to me. 

[w3jn]

Wow.  I'm speechless.

I'm interested in the source of your data that no-coders are "no-talent bums".

I'm also interested in how you determined that no-coders are necessarily clueless about homebrewing and troubleshooting.  As you might be aware, this issue dates back to the 1930's and isn't at all limited to no-coders.

What does CW ability have to do with technical ability?

[Steve - WB3HUZ]

Also, please state the number of times an SOS was ever sent in Morse code on the ham bands.

Can you say RED HERRING?

[Pete, WA2CWA]

So after we load up the bands with no-coders just in favor of numbers won't it be interesting to hear these no talent bums try to decipher an sos in morse code on one of the ham bands?!! 

So what will we dispense with next to attract more into the ham faternity?  Perhaps the FCC will make the AM mode illegal so the potential no coder won't be annoyed by the heterodynes?

This could easily be applied another classes of amateurs who, although they sometimes profess themselves to be “top experienced dogs”, are sometimes totally clueless to operating procedures and any technical sense.

Perhaps we can eliminate all theory because certainly no one in this modern era will want to homebrew much less troubleshoot their rice boxes.  Better yet - homebrewing should be illegal too.  You'll have to have a license to troubleshoot those rice boxes now.  More regulations to regulate the unregulated mass of  cess pool that the FCC has created with no code.  Hey it all makes sense to me. 

Absolutely. All theory should be replaced by questions related to operating procedures, regulations, systems engineering, and a touch of basic software knowledge. Ya got to get with the program; amateur radio is changing; the ARRL said so.
http://www.arrl.org/news/features/2006/11/01/1/
And, a great quote to remember if you feel bummed out on amateur radio:

Amateur Radio. A proud past. An exciting present. A bright future!

[k4kyv]

Perhaps the FCC will make the AM mode illegal so the potential no coder won't be annoyed by the heterodynes?

I'd say that would be a distinct possibility IF the no-code ticket + present-day written exam results in hoards of newcomers to the point that the phone bands become congested again.  The anti-AM crowd will start up the standard P&M about all the "bandwidth" AM uses and the heterodynes from the carrier, so someone will propose to outlaw AM to allow more appliance operators on the band. But I doubt there will be anything near the tidal wave of newcomers that some people are hoping for.

Perhaps we can eliminate all theory because certainly no one in this modern era will want to homebrew much less troubleshoot their rice boxes.  Better yet - homebrewing should be illegal too.

In Canada, and I believe in UK also, they have an entry-level licence that requires the use of unmodified commercially built equipment.  But in UK, when they went no-code, they changed the written test to  make it more challenging.

[Steve - WB3HUZ]

Can we make P&Ming illegal?

[k4kyv]

But wouldn't that outlaw the Piss 'n Moan Net?

Besides, the old farts on slopbucket wouldn't have anything left to talk about except their ailments.

[W9GT]

As I posted earlier, the Amateur Industry (with apologies to Pete) holds far too much sway over amateur radio rulemaking proceedings. It wasn't a good thing way back when, or presently, and it probably will cause the Amateur Radio Service even more harm down the road.

All of these differently-qualified Technician, General, and Amateur Extra class have given rise to factions, bickering factions that generally don't get along well. Divided we fall.

I agree that the Morse tests are/were irrelevant, however, they were a good filter to allow genuinely motivated people into the hobby. And I don't mean to imply all no-code/slow-code people are unmotivated, or not an asset to ham radio. And I also do not wish to imply that passing a 13 or 20 wpm code test solves all the societal ills of the Amateur Radio Service. We are all aware of exceptionally well qualified licensees who cause a lot of grief for ham radio. Eventually they make their way onto Mr. Hollinsworth's radar screen. The problem with amateur testing over the past 25-30 years is the ongoing relaxation of test requirements, not limited to Morse Code.

As CW testing has been gutted, and is now soon to be phased out, I see nothing coming along with the written test in terms of bringing it up to date, either from a technical perspective or an operating point of view.

I disagree with those who say we need more numbers of amateurs (with apologies to Mr. Mike). More people to communicate with is a good thing, but I'll take quality over quantity any day.

I also disagree with those who say the technical stuff is irrelevant, and should be replaced with questions about safety, rules and regulations, and operating procedures (Sorry again Pete). Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think ham radio is for everyone. We might not always be so blessed to live in the days of wine and roses. A pool of proficient, technically well versed operators is a good thing to have around if things get *REALLY* bad.

There is nothing wrong with spending 'time in grade'. I was a Tech Plus, pre-2000, one who ran exclusively CW on 80, 40, and 15 meters. So maybe I would only have been able to pass the 13 wpm code test a couple of years ago to earn a General Class ticket. SO WHAT? Better to have passed the same CW test as everyone else, NO FACTIONS CREATED!

As it is the FCC and it's minions, by catering to instant gratification and feelings of entitlement, is creating more disagreeable factions with this latest wave of rulemaking re: amateur testing.

I have no problem with memorization and can probably pass the Amateur Extra written exam without a whole lot of trouble. And being permitted to operated AM from 3600 to 3800 is like a big, red, shiny apple in the window. But I'm afraid this could turn out to be one more Pyrrhic victory.

Very well stated indeed!!  CW, whether you are an opponent or proponent, is not really the issue.  Regardless of when you earned your license, you should probably be at least concerned, if not down right offended, by the "cheapening of the effort" through the continual reduction of the requirements.  Growth is important, but quality growth should be the rule.....  Not just an increase in numbers to achieve some imagined advantage or greater leverage. 

73,  Jack, W9GT

[Pete, WA2CWA]

I disagree with those who say we need more numbers of amateurs (with apologies to Mr. Mike). More people to communicate with is a good thing, but I'll take quality over quantity any day.

I also disagree with those who say the technical stuff is irrelevant, and should be replaced with questions about safety, rules and regulations, and operating procedures (Sorry again Pete). Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think ham radio is for everyone. We might not always be so blessed to live in the days of wine and roses. A pool of proficient, technically well versed operators is a good thing to have around if things get *REALLY* bad.

73
Doug, KA3TGV

One could apply some of the same logic to obtaining a driver’s license. Can’t join the driving fraternity until you demonstrate proficiency in technical and mechanical knowledge in the operation and maintenance of an automobile in your written driving test.

However, I will agree that’s it’s helpful to acquire some basic knowledge to be able to discuss or explain a problem with a qualified technician/mechanic to resolve your car issues when there is a problem. Amateur radio is a communicating arena. Some people get into it just to “communicate” (i.e. you get a driver’s license just to drive a car).  They don’t need to be tested as to their technical knowledge as to what’s happening under the chassis or between those tiny speck parts on a circuit board or how many joules does this part generate when you wave it in an electrical field. Some like the technical, or getting their hands dirty in the circuitry, of all aspects of radio; others could care less about how their voice gets through the box and out the antenna. Doesn’t make them any more or any less of an amateur radio operator.

We in the amateur radio community can say “quality is better than quantity” but we’re not important here. We can all see that our numbers are declining as each year passes. As amateur radio has to evolve with the changing technologies and government mandates, “numbers” play an important part in our ability to provide visibility to the people (FCC, government officials, etc.) who ultimately control our future density. A declining arena has far less clout then one that is on the rise. As Jack said, “quality growth”, but it’s sometimes better to bit the bullet, drive the numbers up first, and then educate those masses. I’m all for driving up the numbers any way we can. There are probably a lot of talented, non-technical type people out there that would be a great asset to amateur radio.