New Boat Anchor No 19 Wireless Mk11

[VE3LYX]

Thanks, I just got in.
don

[W1RC]

When I was just a lad first becoming interested in radio there were a number of army surplus stores in Montreal where we lived.  Most of them were within a few blocks of each other.  There was ETCO and Universal Ship Supply on McGill Street.  ETCO was owned by Marvin Birnbom, VE2ANN.  ETCO had TONS of surplus stuff.  He later went into mail order big-time.  Although the store was closed decades ago Marvin is still around and I wish him well.  He was very good to the teens who were just becoming interested in this stuff.

There were a couple smaller surplus stores around the corner on Rue Notre Dame that had predominately clothing but some radios too. I remember that one very well because Mike, the guy who owned it, later went to jail for murdering someone.  Another store, North American Electronics, was way out in the "East End" but we didn't go there because it was in the French part of town and it was like going to Poland.  They later changed their name to NORAMEL.  They had some 19 Set parts in the late 80s which is the last time I visited the area.  Maybe they still have 'em.

Anyway, they all had big piles of these tank radios, 19 Sets: transceivers, power supplies, mics, antenna "variometers" keys, headphones, cables, manuals, etc, and they were diet cheap.  They were all Russian sets that never were shipped because the war ended before they could be sent.  Since they were made in Montreal by RCA Victor that is where the bulk of them were sold off in the early 1960s as surplus,

I bought one around 1964 and so did my buddy Larry Cummings. We figured how to hook them up.  The ones we bought had the AC power supplies.  We played around with them a bit and of course soon fired up the transmitters.  I didn't worry too much that I didn't have my amateur radio licence at this point.  

Instantly I got a knock on my door; my mother complaining that "something is wrong with the TV".  Larry got exactly the same reaction at his house too.

I took it back to the store the next day and brought home a Marconi CSR-5A receiver.  

This was my only experience with a 19 Set.

I heard later that someone went around and bought many of them.   Story goes that they eventually ended up in Africa.

I was amazed in the mid 1990s when I learned that there was serious interest in 19 Sets and people actually wanted them.  My opinion of them has not changed in fifty years.

Still, they are a piece of history.

73,

Michael, W1RC

[VE3LYX]

Wow, I moved to Montreal in 1964, Pointe Claire to be exact. Spooky. I was never attracted much to the 19 sets probably because of the Russian lettering on the Canadian Sets. I have been to many of those shops however my favourite was Radio Centre in Chomedy . Had to drive by the Canadair plant to get there.  I belonged back then to the Lindsay Place High School Amateur Radio Club. I had at this point 17 working crystal sets of various designs and built my first regen then. Still have several crystal sets and several regens. I was in love with the 19 sets predessor the No 11 transciever. It had a huge ceramic handled  switch dead centre for going from RX to TX and ran off a pair of DynoMs. I had two. My pal Frans Dykstra also had a couple. When I moved back to Ontario I left them there. Why I have no idea.
I enjoy the old sets. And I like them just the way they were, not modified or improved. I love that old "bandits at 2 oclock" sound. It is what got me interested in Ham Radio listening to the old dudes on my regen or one of my No 11 sets. I didn't expect to enjoy these No 19 sets as much as I do. I had no cabling or controls etc but neither did I back then or even recently for my ARC 5 Txs and RXs. Not hard to figure out and make. I have this one set now on the air. They lack big power which is not good but I did try it successfully on my 811A linear. The Rx is quite sensitive. As I work away on them making controls and cabling I have been listening to your neighbours. Timmy Clark Larry etc with ease (on a speaker BTW. ) I have taken a few swatts at TXing but so far just got a" heard someone else in there"
don
I also discovered they will sneak down into 160M just far enough to be useful.

[VE3LYX]

Got a response in poor conditions this afternoon. However band noise was high so had to give up Still was heard . Was running 1/2 power on PA (250 volts. ) Finished hooking up another 250 volt supply so I could stack the supply outputs to provide 500v approx to the 807 PA. Works well.  Receiver on this rig is very sensitive and a real pleasure to use. I can see it will be replacing my DX60B and HR10B. To put it bluntly, I like it.
don

[VE3AJM]

When I was just a lad first becoming interested in radio there were a number of army surplus stores in Montreal where we lived.  Most of them were within a few blocks of each other.  There was ETCO and Universal Ship Supply on McGill Street.  ETCO was owned by Marvin Birnbom, VE2ANN.  ETCO had TONS of surplus stuff.  He later went into mail order big-time.  Although the store was closed decades ago Marvin is still around and I wish him well.  He was very good to the teens who were just becoming interested in this stuff.

There were a couple smaller surplus stores around the corner on Rue Notre Dame that had predominately clothing but some radios too. I remember that one very well because Mike, the guy who owned it, later went to jail for murdering someone.  Another store, North American Electronics, was way out in the "East End" but we didn't go there because it was French.  They later changed their name to NORAMEL.  They had some 19 Set parts in the late 80s which is the last time I visited the area.  Maybe they still have 'em.

Anyway, they all had big piles of these tank radios, 19 Sets: transceivers, power supplies, mics, antenna "variometers" keys, headphones, cables, manuals, etc, and they were diet cheap.  They were all Russian sets that never were shipped because the war ended before they could be sent.  Since they were made in Montreal by RCA Victor that is where the bulk of them were sold off in the early 1960s as surplus,

I bought one around 1964 and so did my buddy Larry Cummings. We figured how to hook them up.  The ones we bought had the AC power supplies.  We played around with them a bit and of course soon fired up the transmitters.  I didn't worry too much that I didn't have my amateur radio licence at this point.  

Instantly I got a knock on my door; my mother complaining that "something is wrong with the TV".  Larry got exactly the same reaction at his house too.

I took it back to the store the next day and brought home a Marconi CSR-5A receiver.  

This was my only experience with a 19 Set.

I heard later that someone went around and bought many of them.   Story goes that they eventually ended up in Africa.

I was amazed in the mid 1990s when I learned that there was serious interest in 19 Sets and people actually wanted them.  My opinion of them has not changed in fifty years.

Still, they are a piece of history.

73,

Michael, W1RC

My experiences with the # 19 Set started back in Jr high just prior to getting my ticket.

Back in the late 70s and early 80s the sets were widely available on "radio row" in downtown Toronto at places like Radio Trade Supply, Dominion Radio and later at General Electronics run by Jerry Sky, VE3FKS in North York ON mostly lined up like cord wood in the stores..there were 100s of them brand new in the boxes. My first reaction back then, and it holds the same today is that this tx is ugly, big, and puts out a mosquito fart of power..

An older friend in high school and I bought two for $25 each, and got them going with HB power supplies. As you say..they were a horrible TVI generator, and caused problems with neighbours even though we lived in a rural area.
We often wondered if the Lend Lease program with the USSR and the #19 sets during WW2,was all some kind of British intelligence countermeasure, to mess up the Russians and their tanks, so we could beat them to Berlin or something. And the Canadian Forces were using these things til the mid 60s..for what??

We managed to get about 7 watts output on AM on 75m with the grid modulation scheme. The audio sounded very restricted. We raised Ashtabula Bill as I remember, but all he said was that he could hear a weak carrier in there with very little audio.

We finally decided to tear out the VHF xcvr out of them and install a plate modulator using a pair of 6BQ5s, and a small Hammond mod transformer. We got about 25watts output carrier and made many contacts with it on 75 and 40m. We could communicate across town fine in the middle of the night when the TVs were mostly off. Yeah..we built "another radio in a radio" as 15 yr olds..no problem..no passive aggressive bs about modifying an old tx..geez..we wanted to be heard..have an actual REAL QSO....there was no intronet...if you wanted a contact, you had to actually be heard on the band...what a concept?.

I found the #19 Set Net years later with Dave VA3ORP Chris Basillion CBK? and Dave BBN. I found it curious that their net was on SSB, not AM, and none were using any #19 Set. On asking them, they said that they couldn't copy each other using the set. We later sold the #19 Sets and Hbed a single 6146 tx which had no TVI, and was much more compact, with good audio. Later picked up a bunch of ART-13s and built up HB power supplies etc. from the same surplus stores. A much better purchase and results. That's a real transmitter.

Al VE3AJM

[VE3LYX]

They are very popular in NL Belgium and France. Huge group using them regularly. In fact one just won the Winter Multi mode contest in Dec. A tuner cleans up the TVI instantly and it is usually only on 3700 to 3750 because of the mixing they use. In fact the 813 linear that Canada made for them has a network in it to clean this up. Biggest drawback is the low power , in reality about 5 actual watts output. They are also not microphone tolerant but need a very specific mic or impedance. My regualar shack mic would not work properly but a little research turned up the proper spec and type and bingo! However shoved into a linear there is enough power to produce a decent signal. Several I have talked to who have them are regularly working several hundred miles in good conditions barefoot. I have been in touch with two online who have worked 400 miles with them. I am enjoying mine but then it doesn't take a lot to amuse me. They are still world over a very popular radio with a huge following. I was quite surprised to be honest.
I see them for sale in working condition for $700 to $2200. I stole these I think. I didn't expect them to still work. Not a ART13 for sure but probably the "radio that won the war" with no exaggeration. I especially like the receiver.
don 

[VE3AJM]

Yeah..my experience with them is that they are a horrible tx for use on the hambands yesterday/today as is.  They are unuseable in the real world.
.sorry..knock youself out..my time and energy are valuable. Not interested. We used tuners and rebuilt the sets with TVI proofing and bypassing the power leads etc.
Still tore up the TVs and the audio was very low and sounded terrible using the low level modulation. But thats what you're looking for..so perfect then?? right

The big 19 set net gurus agree. I moved on from them 30 yrs ago. Back to the future..ground hog day. I wouldnt pay $1 in Canadian Tire money for one.

The radio that prolonged WW2 would be more accurate to describe it.

Al VE3AJM

[VE3LYX]

There you go. Silly me I didn't know.  I will stop enjoying it immediately.
don

[W4EWH]

Yeah..my experience with them is that they are a horrible tx for use on the hambands yesterday/today as is.  They are unuseable in the real world.

OM,

Look at the bright side: if we hadn't given so many of the them to the Soviets during WWII, we wouldn't have the Svetlana factory making tubes now.

W1AC

[VE3AJM]

Oh, I should have written 5 cents of Crappy Tire money. Thats the lowest denomination. 

Al VE3AJM

[Steve - K4HX]

Crappy Tire money?

[VE3AJM]

A term of endearment for the store coupons.

Al VE3AJM

[VE3LYX]

I am really enjoying this radio. The more I work with it the better I understand it. Glad I decided to put in a rescue offer.
I now get a response almost every time I switch to TX. I have the power out level up to hi end of stock specs. I stacked two 250v supplies to get full voltage on the 807 final. 250v on main Tx and Rx and an additional 250 above for the PA tube. Works nicely. Sounds good too. I like the receiver too. It is not noisy and very sensitive. Sometimes with old sets I double monitor or use a back up rx just in case. With this set there is no need. And it runs off my 12 volt  battery bank. There is huge (I should say HUGE) support for these sets all the way from Australia to South America to Scandinavia the UK and Europe as well as here in Canada and the USA. NL being a real hot bed of activity and they are not shelf queens (Like "I have seven of those and three of those but haven't put them on air yet" stuff.etc) They are on the air using them in nets and surplus radio contests etc.   I am not sorry for a second I took the plunge. It brings a smile to my face each time I fire it up. I am beginning to understand why they are so popular world wide. I went back through some of my travel photos and found some on display in pictures in Europe. Never thought I would be enjoying them. Everything you get right with them like mic input voltages etc seems to pay back with a positive response. And I like working with lower power stuff so this suits me fine. I tried the MCW the other night. Someone asked what it sounded like and I realized I didnt know myself so I dealt with it immediately. Sounds like listening to a normal CPO. Like your Heathkit electronic paddle keyers side tone for instance and it does have side tone in the speaker when you are using MCW. I even tried cathode modulating it through the Key hole. it worked but the stock mod sounds far better once you get the mic type and impedance right. Yesterday I was able to drive my linear to near full output (meaning normal full output as I use it here IE 100 watts or so.) However I am able to work south of here with its normal power with it so I think I will run it barefoot most days.
A trio of ARC5s. A pair of No 19s. Life is good! Never expected to be having this much fun at 65.
don

[VE3LYX]

This is becoming a very interesting adventure. There is a lot of world wide support for these radios and I have been reading. One of the things I was concerned about was the low AM power. I figured that rising the PA plate voltage to max levels would make a huge difference and it does a bit but read that experiments have shown that because of the 807s 24k internal resistance that raising the screen voltage increased power more then raising the plate voltage. IE a 25 volt increase in screen voltage makes a large difference while a 100 volt increase in plate voltage makes a difference but not huge. I guess plate current is what one wants and the screen is standing in the way if it is low. The writer went on to say the the British sets which were dynamotor supplied both HT1 (low high voltage for rx and osc mod etc) and HT2(PA plate) ran higher voltages then the Canadian Sets which used a vibrator supply for HT1. He had done some testing and found transmitter output to be much better on the Dynamotor HT1 supply then the vibrator supply. The vib supply is somewhere between 220 and 275 volts depending on you luck your battery and your recharging system. The dynamotor British set was producing almost 300 volts for the same deal and this also supplies the 807 PA screens. I knew the ARC5s I have like a higher screen voltage and I push the  1625s(Essentially 12V 807s) at scream level (324 volts on the 80m one). The No 19 is a lot more complicated rig and a bit rarer so I didn't want to push it that hard. I have been running it on a vibrator power supply I liberated from the corner of a 57 ford radio a friend was throwing out. And it was a 12 volt conversion as well so is probably in reality a 55 design. (6 volt) However it will power the No 19 easily without a whimper supplying all HT1 power plus heater voltage. It has a 6x4 rectifier tube. I decided to see if I pulled the 6x4 and inserted a pair of silicon diodes would I gain any significant output. I had a pair for thick lead diodes in my parts box so I quickly twisted them together and inserted two ends into pin 1 and 6 holes and the paired end into pin 7 substituting the tube. I was shocked to see almost 50 extra volts on the HT1 meter position. Not only that but the heater voltage was up (LT position on meter) almost 1 volt with the 6x4 heater out of the loop. I didn't expect such a gain. I decided to check the output on AM. I feed my longwire off my ARC5 and this No 19 through what was known as the simplified antenna tuner from the 1940s other handbook. Since I only need it for 80M and 40m I included only that coil. It has a clip lead and about 20 loops at every couple of turns and looks like a momma pig at feeding time. Across the end is a dual 365 variable cap. It works surprisingly well despite its simple design. I also installed when I built it a light bulb pigtail across the output coax connector so I can also use it for tuneup with a dummy load. I keep nearby a 7.5 watt a 15 watt and a 100 watt light bulb for testing and tune up. Light bulbs never lie. Meters sometimes do. For this rig I have been using the 7.5 watt bulb. So I hooked it back up , unplugged the antenna and screwed the bulb home. I had managed in the past week to raise output to yellow. Initially it was dull orange. With the rectifier tube subbed it was now bright yellow and on a good OOOOOOOOOOOLAAAAAAAAAAAH was full brightness. I know from experience that is enough power to have a decent QSO under good conditions. That is all I am looking for. I say all this because there are things here that may be something others are dealing with or wondering about so even if one doesn't have a No 19 the principles are still valid. As you can probably tell I am enjoying every minute of this adventure.
don

AS for CTC I spent 11 years working there. First on the Belleville shop floor (early 1970s) then running the shop for several years(1980s). Made a lot of CTC$$$ as it was a great place to work dollar wise. (paid more then teaching college did later on. )However no one would have enough of those (CTC funny money or pictures of the Queen) to pry this radio loose now. It is here to stay !!!!!!!!!!!

[W1RC]

A term of endearment for the store coupons.
Al VE3AJM

I remember this stuff. Maybe even have a few Canadian Tire dollars around here somewhere.  Used to get 4% back in these "dollars".  Very high quality printing, Cabadian Bank Note Company; same company that prints the real stuff.

Thanks for the memories.

73,

Michael, W1RC

[VE3LYX]

Here is that test. This is with no modulation but batteries are fully charged. If I had known this Simplified Antenna Tuner and its dummy load deal (my idea)would become such an often used device in my shack I would have built it prettier. I didn't however it is a very very useful device that cost me nothing out of pocket. For home brewing and quick testing it is hard to beat. I use it for intital tune up and check final tuneup watching my shacks field strength meter. This comes so close though that if I didn't have the Field Strength meter I would still be good to go. When you run low power though you tend to want all of it.  
don
I am seriously considering installing a similar but perhaps prettier socket assembly in my BiG homebrew HD antenna tuner instead of its meter. It is so quick and easy and so unmistakable in its indications the temptation is strong. In this little one I leave it unscrewed a couple of turns when not loading the bulb but in the big one I think I would install a switch. My big tuner is a PI style capable of full legal power if required and can also be switched to a series Cap if desired. Both tuners seem to improve my signals and help clean up bad stuff. I tend to use them on all my AM or CW rigs  but my DX60B. 

[AJ1G]

If I recall correctly, the output  circuit of the final amplifier is a parallel resonant tank circuit, with  the plate voltage series fed through the coil, and a fixed secondary link of a few turns.  Not sure what output impedance it wants to load into, but it likely was set up to feed a low impedance  mobile or short ground mounted whip and counterpoise which was accomplished through the external variometer that the sets were always equipped with. Without the variometer you might be able to squeeze a bit more power out by increasing the number of turns on the tank circuit secondary, as was/is frequently done on the command set transmitters.  If you don't want to make any internal mods, you could try using a broadband 1 to 4 un un impedance step up transformer, or use an external antenna matching circuit for the best match from the transmitter to your antenna load impedance.

When I first put my MK II set on the air, I made a simple mod to the output circuit that changed it to a pi network, by adding a plate blocking cap and and RF choke for the final plate DC feed, using the existing final tuning cap for plate tuning and the original tank coil primary as the pi net inductance, and an external 2X 365 pF receiving type variable in a small box as the loading cap.  With this arrangement, I can get about 20-25 W watts out on CW on 80 meters, and about 7-8 watts on voice into a nominal 50 ohm impedance antenna.  Output on 40 is maybe 75% of that on 80.  In the pi net arrangement, the original frequency calibration of the final tuning dial will be way off, but I can resonate it all the way from the top end of 160 meters (which like you noted, can be tuned to below the nominal 2 MHz bottom of the set's band A range) up through 40 meters.

I have had very good luck using an amplified D 104 to drive the dynamic mic input directly, and it sounds fairly good with that arrangement.  You can also use any good quality dynamic mic through something like a Rat Shack octave band EQ which provides some adjustable gain, and feed in to the 19 set from the line level vs mic level EQ output. The original No. 7 hand mic's dynamic element coil was an open circuit (most of them are, they use very fine wire that just corrodes away), however, I was able to insert a telephone type carbon element into it along with a AA 1.5V battery and a small trim pot all hooked in series, with the one of the mic's original two PTT normally open contact switches in the circuit to limit mic current flow to only on transmit, and picked the audio off the pot wiper through a series decoupling cap and the "bottom" of the pot.  Gives more than enough output, sounded OK, and the battery lasts a very long time. The other mic PTT contact of course is used to key the transmitter.  I also have an original operator's headset, which like the mic, had open circuited coil elements.  I was able to fit some small walkman type headphone elements into the ear pieces, they sound just fine connected directly to the set, even though the element impedance is fairly low.

[VE3LYX]

Very interesting info. Thank you very much. Some of those paths I have been down with other sets but there are several great tips there. Thanks for taking the time. I was testing a different 500v supply today on 7290kc. IDed at the changeover and asked if there was any copy. Got a response about poor conditions and QSB but was called by name. He went on to say to the others "Don is running low power and is on batteries." I thought must be some other Don and listened for awhile but didn't hear any other by that name.  I am not counting it because I didn't think it was possible at that distance but as you can imagine it got my heart rate up a bit and I am a bit confused if it was just another Don also running low power on batteries or did someone actually hear enough of my signal to know it was me. I don't know what to think. Very creative your Pi network conversion. Thanks for the ideas.
don

[VE3LYX]

Logged my first solid AM contact on the No 19 today. The band was noisy but we got it done. 184.1 miles on around 5 watts out. I am happy with that. Thanks Tom in Erie PA!
don

[VE8NSD]

Your adventure has really inspired me! I bought up a bunch of WS19's and AR-88's when nobody wanted them. Now that I see all of the fun that you are having I'll have to get a WS-19 running.
Thanks again for the inspiration. If you need parts email me at my QRZ.com address and I'll try to help as best I can.
73
Garth

[VE3LYX]

I hadn't planned on enjoying them Garth, I just couldn't see a piece of history going to land fill. Now I love it. When Tom came back to me I almost had a heart attack! AR88s Seems to me I remember when one could buy them surplus in the 1960s.
don
I am fairly content with this set now so I reached under the bench for the other No 19 , a very rough MK111 version. It may get hot rodded a little before it is done. It can never be a shelf queen anyway.
don

[VE3LYX]

UPDATE, This morning I was reading the mail on 40M listening to a discussion of mobile ops and old miltary AM set. One was running a BC 116 or 611 or something. I thought hmmmmm I am listening on a No 19 running on a 12vibrator PS and am all ready to go. About the time the Nonet net started and I gave it a shot. They heard me! On about 6 watts barefoot! At one point net control even gave me a 10 over report. (Must have been a burst in propagation) I tell you I wish no more. Band conditions as you know if you were on this morning were a bit noisy.This radio has exceeded all my expectations. It is currently my rig of choice for AM.
don