Omni VII on AM?

[WS4B]

The next few months I am planning to buy a brand new radio, which is something I have never done before. It is paramount that it can sound good on AM as well as have six meter capabilities. I want the presence of knobs and buttons, so I am not looking to go the SDR route.

I have read from web searches that the Ten Tec Omni VII is a really good sounding radio on AM. In addition it features 9 Kc AM recieve filtering from what I understand. So the point of this post is our these claims true? Has anyone had AM experience with this radio, or know of one who has?

Any feedback is most appreciated. Thank you.

[Pete, WA2CWA]

It's interesting that in the user's/operating manual, issue 1, the only mention of "AM" in the entire document is in the specification sheet where it's listed as one of the modes. I could not find any further reference to it in the entire document. In the product brochure they give "transmitter bandwidth 1000-4000 Hz" and "transmitter frequency response 70-4000 Hz max" but don't indicate what modes. Can't recall working anyone on AM that used one of these rigs.

[W3GMS]

I have a Ten Tec Jupiter which preceded the Omni 7.   In fact, Ten Tec is still selling the Jupiter.  I do not use the Jupiter as my primary AM exciter, but the times I have put it on AM, the reports have been very good.  I would imagine that the Jupiter and Omni 7 from an AM generation scheme are very similar.  Even when I use my boat anchors to get on AM, I usually use the Jupiter as the receiver.  The DSP IF filtering allows the receiver selectivity to go out to 8 KHz which sounds really great when conditions allow that wide of a RX IF passband.  The next step down is 6 KHz and then from there it goes in small steps all the way down to 300 Hz.  On the Jupiter, the AM TX bandwidth is limited to 3.9 KHz which can be adjusted down in relatively small steps.  Those steps are applicable for SSB as well.  Both SSB and AM bandwidth are synchronous to one another.  For receive, I tap off the detector and run to an external audio amp/speaker system.  For TX, I feed the audio from my external audio chain right into the line input which is available on the back of the rig. 

Its certainly not the quality of my modified Ranger but as mentioned, the reports have been very good and it easily achieves 100% modulation when the carrier is limited to 25W. 

Joe, W3GMS
   

[W3FJJ]

Don't own one, but have heard one on AM, and I thought it sounded  very respectable.
I think It was Wb2EJG, but Its been awhile since I heard him..
If I was in the market for new HF transceiver, I would consider the Omni 7 also...

GL,  Chuck

[WS4B]

Don't own one, but have heard one on AM, and I thought it sounded  very respectable.
I think It was Wb2EJG, but Its been awhile since I heard him..
If I was in the market for new HF transceiver, I would consider the Omni 7 also...

GL,  Chuck

Thanks Chuck and to everyone else for their replies. That is all I am looking for in a new radio, respectability on AM. I love my FT-102 on AM, but like I said in my OP I have never owned a new rig before and wish to. I am also surprised that TT gives no reference to AM use in it's owners manual of the Omni VII.

Lastly, what I like about TT is their 30 day return policy minus shipping. If for some reason it sounds like a real dog on the mode, I can get my money back. Unless I hear some real discouraging comments in the next few weeks, I'll probably pull the trigger.

Thanks again everyone.

[ke7trp]

The one I heard sounded ok.  But not great.

The sound has alot to do with the setup and microphone of course.  Most riceboxes and SDR's all sound about the same to me. Some better then others. I think you will be fine with the ten tec.

C

[KZ5A]

The other American made radio that does a respectable job on AM is the Elecraft K3.

[ke7trp]

Woa... the K3 is up there with the worst of them. Sounds like complete garbage.  the K3 is a CW radio, that happens to do SSB.  Nice radio, But I cant imagine anyone buying one and using it on AM.

C

[KL7OF]

Woa... the K3 is up there with the worst of them. Sounds like complete garbage.  the K3 is a CW radio, that happens to do SSB.  Nice radio, But I cant imagine anyone buying one and using it on AM.

C

I have heard several K3s on AM and I thought they sounded just fine

[W8IXY]

I get great reports on my K3 on AM.   Even with no external "processing", using some "gentle" tweaking of the transmit EQ, and a Shure SM58 microphone, I have had several reports that the K3 "sounds like a plate modulated rig".   I usually set the K3 to about 12 watts carrier output, and run it into an AL811h running about 150 watts carrier.   Great reports and it looks good on the monitor scope.



73
Ted  W8IXY

[K6JEK]

I have an OMNI VII and have used it on AM. I got OK reports but it would not do 100% modulation. That may have been fixed with a firmware upgrade. I didn't pursue it because I have other AM transmitters.

There is a Ten-Tec forum. I bet you could get  definitive answers there.

If you're interested in that other mode, the one that starts with an S and ends with a B, A/B tests out here showed the OMNI the winner in audio quality largely because it can go pretty wide. The OMNI also has a remote feature which no other rig I know of has -- ability to be remote over the Internet with no local computer. You need one at the remote end but not one connected to the OMNI VII. Plug the OMNI into your router and you're good to go. You do need pretty good Internet characteristics.

[K6JEK]

I just Googled OMNI VII on AM. Apparently others get it to sound terrific. As I said, I didn't really try.  Here is a sample post

The OMNI-VII sounds much better on AM than an FT-101E does. No comparison.

Since all modulation and demodulation in the TT rig is all DSP based, you can adjust it to sound any way you like.

Tips for transmitting on AM:

-Set output power (carrier level) to 25W.
-Set low frequency modulation to 300 Hz.
-Set TX bandwidth to 3.9 kHz.
-Adjust mike gain for 100W PEP output power using a 'scope or PEP wattmeter. If you don't have a scope or a PEP meter, a "hint" when the mike gain is adjusted correctly is if the ALC LED on the front panel just starts to flicker on voice peaks as you're modulating.

For receiving on AM:

-Set receiver bandwidth to 6 kHz.
-Turn noise blanker OFF.
-Turn AGC to FAST.

Voila! FAR better performance than the old Yaesu. Hands-down.

In fact, you can make the OMNI-VII sound exactly like a real high level modulated rig. Nobody can tell the difference on the air.

Do not attempt to do this at any higher carrier power level than 25W.

WB2WIK/6

From:


http://forums.qrz.com/archive/index.php/t-202524.html

[ke7trp]

3.9 for each sideband is nearly 8KC wide for AM transmit. Not bad.

C

[WS4B]

JEK

It was that post and that thread in general that got me thinking along the lines of an Omni VII.

http://forums.qrz.com/archive/index.php/t-202524.html

I passed consideration on the Orion II since it doesn't have six meters. A few on here have said the the Omni VII is average to good on AM. Mic and power set up along with EQing can go a long way in getting the best out of something.

I have little interest in using the radio on SSB. Again would just like a new rig, and would also enjoy FM on 6 and 10 when the band permits.

[kb3rdt]

I thought Kenwood TS-590S sound good on AM and it has 6 meters!

[K6JEK]

JEK

It was that post and that thread in general that got me thinking along the lines of an Omni VII.

http://forums.qrz.com/archive/index.php/t-202524.html

I passed consideration on the Orion II since it doesn't have six meters. A few on here have said the the Omni VII is average to good on AM. Mic and power set up along with EQing can go a long way in getting the best out of something.

I have little interest in using the radio on SSB. Again would just like a new rig, and would also enjoy FM on 6 and 10 when the band permits.

Incidentally, I really like the OMNI VII.

[WS4B]

Here is a reply from the head service guy at TT, when I e-mailed him about getting 100% modulation out of the Omni VII.


Dear Brad:

Yes, the Omni VII will have 100% modulation. AM is created in the DSP and sounds very close to the plate modulated AM on my Johnson Viking Rangers.

73, Paul R. Clinton
WD4EBR
Service Manager


So we'll see what happens as I plan to purchase sometime before Labor Day, and will return the radio if neccessary within 30 days.

[W4NEQ]

My Kenwood 590S isn't a bad rig, but it does not transmit anywhere close to 100% positive AM modulation -plenty of negative mod though.

Chris

I thought Kenwood TS-590S sound good on AM and it has 6 meters!

[Pete, WA2CWA]

My Kenwood 590S isn't a bad rig, but it does not transmit anywhere close to 100% positive AM modulation -plenty of negative mod though.

Chris

I thought Kenwood TS-590S sound good on AM and it has 6 meters!

I haven't looked at the TS-590S schematics in detail but isn't this just the action of the AGC in the AM mode? It sounds similar to the same type of AM action you see with most of the current and recently passed Icom rigs. It's designed so that, when you hang a linear on it, the AM peaks won't over drive the linear into distortion. It really isn't negative or "downward" as some people call it.

[Steve - K4HX]

This is considered sounding good?

I just Googled OMNI VII on AM. Apparently others get it to sound terrific. As I said, I didn't really try.  Here is a sample post

The OMNI-VII sounds much better on AM than an FT-101E does. No comparison.

-Set low frequency modulation to 300 Hz.

WB2WIK/6

From:


http://forums.qrz.com/archive/index.php/t-202524.html

[kb3ouk]

If the AGC on that rig acts anything like the AGC on a FT-901DM, you want to set it to SLOW, not FAST. I know from experience that setting the AGC to fast on my 901 will trash a good signal beyond readability.

[K6JEK]

This is considered sounding good?

I just Googled OMNI VII on AM. Apparently others get it to sound terrific. As I said, I didn't really try.  Here is a sample post

The OMNI-VII sounds much better on AM than an FT-101E does. No comparison.

-Set low frequency modulation to 300 Hz.

...
WB2WIK/6

From:


http://forums.qrz.com/archive/index.php/t-202524.html

I think this is, a few sentences down in the same post:

In fact, you can make the OMNI-VII sound exactly like a real high level modulated rig. Nobody can tell the difference on the air.

I suppose I could run the test. My OMNI VII is sitting right next to my class E fed with the same audio chain. I have to admit severe skepticism. I would not be shocked to equal say my Ranger but the class E is very classy.

[kb3rdt]

AGC is for receiver...

ALC is for the transmitt! 

[ke7trp]

What sounds good anymore?  Does the speaker in an elevator sound good?  Does your speaker on your Iphone sound good?  Does your clock radio sound HiFi? 

Everyone has an idea on what sounds good and clearly, alot of us differ in opinions because now, people think a K3 or a 590 sounds good.  I will talk to anyone that I can understand but and wish everyone would try out AM.  But lets not get crazy here and think that a Yeacomwood is going to sound like a BC transmitter.

[KW4DE]

I have a TS-590 and do see 100% mod.  Try playing around with the carrier control in the menu.  I set mine to 50. I can run the mic gain up to nearly full blast and and still not detect  the ALC distortion common to some rigs that begin to cut back.  For me, a Heil HM-12, mic gain set to 65, and menu equalizer set to HB1 shows better than 100% on my Diawa peak hold meter.  Play around with the menu settings and use the monitor function or external receiver while xmiting into a dummy until you find something to your liking.  Also, toss the hand mic....sounds like a clothspin on your nose...and get a good dynamic mic.  I drive an L4-B in the 15 watt AM output level from the transceiver.  No, you wont see a large forward avg bump on the watt meter but it does sound decent.  As for the external battery/pot feeding into the ALC jack as in the ICOM trick....won't work on the 590...still looking for an ALC defeat for this rig.
Darrell KW4DE