More RX ANT tests

[Steve - WB3HUZ]

Mine have an offset of 25 feet and are spaced 20 feet. They work FB.

A parallelogram would be simpler - no ground rods and only one termination and matching transformer.

[WA1GFZ]

So you don't use any phase delay between them? I wonder what is the point of staggered layout? Lankford uses a delay based on angle of signal and distance between antennas.

[Steve - WB3HUZ]

Yes, there is phase delay between them. The amount of spacing and the amount of phase delay determines the directional pattern - just like phased verticals, dipoles or any other element.

The amount of phase delay varies with frequency. But so does the spacing with respect to wavelenth, so the delay tracks over frequency for several bands (depends on the spacing/offset between the elements).

So you don't use any phase delay between them? I wonder what is the point of staggered layout? Lankford uses a delay based on angle of signal and distance between antennas.

[WA1GFZ]

I've been playing with a pair of 120 foot beverages and the simulation likes about 48 foot stagger and 48 foot spacing with 120 degrees delay. I let simulation select stagger and spacing after I found 120 degrees worked good. I wish I could do phase delay as a variable with 4NEC2.
I think even the cat would be ticked with me if that was in the back yard.
180 degrees didn't look that good for me. Parallelogram would not fit well in my back yard.
I'm starting to think a KAZ on one side and beverage on the other both facing East and do some more testing. This past weekend beverage seemed better on 75.

[WA1GFZ]

simulation error DA forget what i said

[WA1GFZ]

Not that I have verified the HUZ phased beverages I went back to the loops.
I have simulated 3 loops phased taller than the KAZ configuration with very impressive F/B numbers. I have them for 40 and 80 meters and yet to do 160. The 80 meter version works ok on 40. They are close spaced with around 80 degree phase shift between them. The kicker is the F/B is over 40 dB at 40 degrees elevation. The simulation had to run a while to get there but the pattern is quite pretty. the null off the back is about 180 degrees wide.
Loss are higher than the beverages though

[WA1GFZ]

The phased Flag antenna looks like it will play over 3 bands and has the advantage of lower height.The KAZ on the third band usually ended up quite high angle. Also simulated Dallas Lankford's L/C delay line and found the delay unstable over a wide frequency range. So it will take a different length of coax on each band or a multiple section delay line to be BB. As the frequency approaches Fc of the delay line the delay time takes off. Multiple sections of small delays shift Fc higher. My old fiberglass poles from the Quad could get a new life.

[WA1GFZ]

Flag numbers All bases 1/2 meter above ground All numbers in meters
All matched to 600 ohms feed (not critical)

160m  2.9M high, 9.5M wide, 970 ohms
80M    3.1M high, 7.2M wide, 985 ohms
40M    2.4M high, 4.4M wide, 965 ohms

Shot for 30 degrees angle and let 4nec2 select everything
3 band ant was close to 80 meter size. angle comes up to 45 degrees on 40 but only down about 2 dB at 30 degrees. Spacing 20 meters

[WA1GFZ]

I set up the simulation to select KAZ sizes. all bases 1 meter off the ground. again everything in meters. Again the 80 meter size looks good 160 through 40 meters with more loss on 160. Again simulated for best performance F/B at 30 degrees. Interesting how 4nec2 selected similar sizes for 80M and 40M and was so close to the KAZ I put up at gfz so.

160m= 5.7M high, 18.3M wide, 932 ohms
80m = 3.2m high,  8.9M wide, 860 ohms
40m = 3.7M high, 8.5M wide, 883 ohms.

Next compare Flag and KAZ performance phased. I started with selecting a phase delay and let the program decide best spacing. 2 phased produces a nice wide null off the back.