gas mileage

[GEORGE/W2AMR]

I recently read an interesting article about leaving the  A/C off to improve mileage, and it does. As long as you keep the windows up. When the windows are down and the A/C is off, the  aero drag pulls the mileage down to almost the same number as driving with the A/C on and the windows up.

[k4kyv]

I was at a radio meet in Maine earlier this year and spied a container of the Johnson spreaders.
I grabbed a couple of dozen of them, think they would be cool for the antenna project.
The seller said $5 and I handed a $5 bill.
He wanted $5 each.
Yikes.
Needless to say I passed and bought the W7FG feedline.

Reminds me at Dayton one year a guy had a bunch of unboxed 2A3's mixed in with some other tubes in a cardboard container under the table.  These were special jobs with indirectly heated cathode, but apparently directly interchangeable with regular ones.  Since I use 2A3's in the class B driver stage of one of my transmitters, I picked up a couple of them and asked how much.  He replied "one and a half each".  I counted the ones in the box.  There were 11 altogether.  I pulled out $16 in paper money, and 50¢ in change, handed it to him, and said I'd take all of them.

Turns out he meant $150 each.

I told him he could keep them.

[W2JBL]

 to W1XAW- i'm a few days behind reading this thread, but yes, you may have traction control in that Merc. i have it in my copper car Crown VIc. it works in tandem with the ABS system, which is universally hated by the cops. damn ABS will kill your ass if you are not careful. neither one did anything for me in the snow, but i'm an old school type of driver, and i disabled it. it's controlled by a 50 amp fuse in the "lighting control module" (big fuse box by the battery). simply remove that fuse and you have shut off ABS/tracion control without creating any failure codes in you ECM. the cars are much faster without traction control too, and give better mileage. i get better mileage with 93 octane, but the price difference offsets any gain.

[Bill, KD0HG]

OK, gents...What do you think of THIS MPG enhancement?

http://pesn.com/2005/03/17/6900069_Acetone/

[w3jn]

Chris, you don't have a pushbutton in the glovebox of your Crown Vic to disable the traction control?

[WA1GFZ]

interesting read on the acetone. I guess you wouldn't want to spill any on the side of the car.

[Ed W1XAW]

to W1XAW- i'm a few days behind reading this thread, but yes, you may have traction control in that Merc. i have it in my copper car Crown VIc. it works in tandem with the ABS system, which is universally hated by the cops. damn ABS will kill your ass if you are not careful. neither one did anything for me in the snow, but i'm an old school type of driver, and i disabled it. it's controlled by a 50 amp fuse in the "lighting control module" (big fuse box by the battery). simply remove that fuse and you have shut off ABS/tracion control without creating any failure codes in you ECM. the cars are much faster without traction control too, and give better mileage. i get better mileage with 93 octane, but the price difference offsets any gain.

Thanks,  What does ABS do that makes a vehicle less safe?  My old ABS on a Ford Ranger used to engage all the time but this one has never noticeably engaged.  I'll try the traction control this winter.  I don't anticipate a lot of winter driving issues as the cops all drive pretty much the same thing in the absolute worse conditions.  I used to drive a 2 wheel drive Ranger with weight in the back for a 36 mile commute in Maine winters so I guess I'm not too afraid of this rig.  My traction control will shut right off on the dash (next to the strange pedal adjust thing).  Do you think the traction contol thing is actually engaging and messing with the fuel mileage if your not stomping on it too much??  Just drove South of Boston and back today, very smooth on the highway. 


73 de Ed W1XAW

[W2JBL]

    if you do any extreme driving (like racing) ABS does bad things that can ruin your day. when ABS equipped if you try heavy braking to set a car into a corner at high speed, and are used to modualting the pedal in the old way, you lose that ability. the the ABS can take over because you are sliding the car and suddenly it no longer reacts the way you want. a lot of cops around here wrecked their early (92-97) Crown Vics due to this. the intense vibration generated by the ABS pulsing the brakes off and on  may cause a loss of control during extreme cornering on less than perfect road surfaces, or dirt roads. it's also hell on suspension components. any vibration that intense is tough on parts.

    the traction control on my '98 P71 actually works pretty well in the rain, and was some help to me in the snow. it did not seem to help on ice however. one thing they did right was to bring back a true second gear manual position on the shifter. you can start and remain in second gear form idle to about 80-90 MPH (depending on rear end ratio). i favor that for driving in the snow. most Crown Vics are quite good in the snow, and i have to say a ton better than my Chevy cop cars. the Watts link rear suspension setup
(similar to a dirt track modified)  on the Ford can apply power to the rear wheels very gently compared to the old GM four bar setup when driven intelligently. that makes it harder to break the rear end loose under reduced traction conditions.

    as to traction control vs. mileage it uses the ABS, timing retard, and fuel mixture (goes lean) in various combinations to maintain traction. in otherwords it puts the brakes on selectively. if you keep it on and try to drive agressively it does hurt your mileage.  all this stuff i have learned about these cars are from my own car, and a close friend who owns a fleet of Crown Vic copper cars he has as a fleet of 25 taxis. we detune the cabs, and hotrod our own Fords. for the average driver all this may not make much difference, but for serious performance driving these are major issues. we are running the Ford in fleet service for four years now, and are begining to reinforce frames and alter front end geometry. the handling potential of this package may be the best in a full size domestic car i have ever seen.

[AJ1G]

Bruce, W1UJR wrote further up this thread:

Chris - How did you make out running the wiring for the mobile rig?
Did you find the OEM connector or use the firewall route?

Just finsihed up the install of the FT100D in the 98 Volvo Cross Country tonight, all done escept mounting the HF antenna into the trailer hitch receiver.

I never did find the bulkhead grommet to run my 12 V DC into the passenger compartment that you mentioned Bruce.  The factory OEM accessory connector with 30A from the battery must be buried way up under the under dash trim panels.  I ended up running a well insulated twited pair of No. 10 stranded along the top of the left fender liner, from the battery (double fused there) out past the hood spring, and then down inside the fender cavity in front of the driver door hinge plates.  Jumps into the cockpit very unobtrusively at the bottom front corner of the door, and then goes immediately  under the door's  floor trim plate channel to just behind the driver seat.

Mounted the radio under the drivers seat, along with an amplified speaker.  Put the remoted control head for the time being on the console next to the e brake lever using double backed tape.  Not going to leave it there long, as it will be right under coffee cups with the cupholders in use.  Eventually, plan on using the tracks that support the ashtray in the console under the car stereo receiver to support the control head, with the ashtray removed.

I was a bit oncerned that the 12V leads near the battery have to run really close to the open frame ignition coil that's mounted on the inboard side of the fender well.  Trying to avoid it just would put the wires near the distrbutor and spark plug leads.  But, on air checks on 2M SSB  and FM with a 5/8 wave magmount showed no ignition noise problems with the engine running either at idle or underway.  On HF recieve with no antenna hooked up, had no significant noise pickup via the power leads.

Gong to try coupling the FT100D receive audiio into the cars audio system using one of those little FM transmitters sold for use with IPODs.  I did this in the old Taurus setup, and the audio was really good.

Will be ready to go for the trip to the Military Radio Collectors Association (MRCA)  rally at Gilbert PA on Friday and then Hosstraders in (only) two more weeks!

[Ed W1XAW]

    if you do any extreme driving (like racing) ABS does bad things that can ruin your day. when ABS equipped if you try heavy braking to set a car into a corner at high speed, and are used to modualting the pedal in the old way, you lose that ability. the the ABS can take over because you are sliding the car and suddenly it no longer reacts the way you want. a lot of cops around here wrecked their early (92-97) Crown Vics due to this. the intense vibration generated by the ABS pulsing the brakes off and on  may cause a loss of control during extreme cornering on less than perfect road surfaces, or dirt roads. it's also hell on suspension components. any vibration that intense is tough on parts.

    the traction control on my '98 P71 actually works pretty well in the rain, and was some help to me in the snow. it did not seem to help on ice however. one thing they did right was to bring back a true second gear manual position on the shifter. you can start and remain in second gear form idle to about 80-90 MPH (depending on rear end ratio). i favor that for driving in the snow. most Crown Vics are quite good in the snow, and i have to say a ton better than my Chevy cop cars. the Watts link rear suspension setup
(similar to a dirt track modified)  on the Ford can apply power to the rear wheels very gently compared to the old GM four bar setup when driven intelligently. that makes it harder to break the rear end loose under reduced traction conditions.

    as to traction control vs. mileage it uses the ABS, timing retard, and fuel mixture (goes lean) in various combinations to maintain traction. in otherwords it puts the brakes on selectively. if you keep it on and try to drive agressively it does hurt your mileage.  all this stuff i have learned about these cars are from my own car, and a close friend who owns a fleet of Crown Vic copper cars he has as a fleet of 25 taxis. we detune the cabs, and hotrod our own Fords. for the average driver all this may not make much difference, but for serious performance driving these are major issues. we are running the Ford in fleet service for four years now, and are begining to reinforce frames and alter front end geometry. the handling potential of this package may be the best in a full size domestic car i have ever seen.

Thanks, great explanation.  I went go-kart racing last weekend as part of a bachelor party (and got my ass whipped) and after talking with the other racers your braking explanation makes perfect sense.  I wasn't agressive enough with some braking and basically let the thing slide too much.  I can also see how traction control and gas mileage would worka against each other if you are being aggressive.  My 03 has the shocks (struts, or whatever) on the outside which seems to help the cornering which seemed to dive on previous models.  The only thing that works well on ICE in my experience is studs but they are pretty scary on dry pavement.  Think I'll just take it easy and keep the traction control on if it seems to help.  Noted the second gear advice which I tried today and yes that would be perfect for slippery roads. 
Very 73,  Ed

[Bill, KD0HG]

You'd think it would be easy enough to unplug a module, pull a fuse or snip a wire to disable the ABS in the Vics.
Makes it damn tough to do a bootlegger's U turn ;-)

[w3jn]

A bootlegger's turn uses the parking brake, which is completely independent of the ABS system.

My Crown Vic does bootlegger's turns very well, thank you 

[W2VW]

A bootlegger's turn uses the parking brake, which is completely independent of the ABS system.

My Crown Vic does bootlegger's turns very well, thank you 

Just allow a little cool off time between these. Those little drum park brakes hold onto the heat!

[KE1GF]

OK, gents...What do you think of THIS MPG enhancement?

http://pesn.com/2005/03/17/6900069_Acetone/

Interesting, yes I did pass college chem at WPI and we used acetone all the time in the lab to accelerate the evaporation of deionized water when we cleaned our apparatus.

I know by observation in the lab that it does speed the evaporation of water, I don't know the physics behind why... I don't know how much truth is behind it improving fuel economy, it's an organic compound so traces of it can be found in soil and water. I believe it's sold in the hardware store for stripping and possibly accelerating the drying of water based paint... It may cause degeneration of plastic components in the fuel system (o-rings, hoses), not sure. I wouldn't put it in my truck!

One more point that slipped my mind... hardware store acetone is poor quality, not like gasoline is that great ether  but I can tell you that the stuff at the pump has to meet specifications of the local towns department of weights and measures for octaine or at least it's "supposed to" 

[W2JBL]

 yanking out the ABS fuse on my P71 caused no codes on a code scanner. i have about 30,000 miles on it that way, no problem. and yes, the spring/shock setup, and front end are very different 2003 and up. the front end now uses coilovers ,with rack and pinion steering. it's all bolted to a huge forged aluminum crossmember that bolts between the frame rails. very slick (and sturdy) setup. i have no problem doing bootlegger turns in my car as long as the emergency brake is working. police Crown Vics are a bit loose (oversteer) to begin with so it don't take much to get it to go around. if you plan on crashing your 1998-2001 P71 DO NOT do a 180 to avoid hitting head on and "back into" your target. rear impact can cause the gas tank to explode.

    i don't have an HF rig in the car yet, but i do have a GE RANGR 110W VHF rig (it even has a few genuine 2 M CB channels in it). i ran the control cable in the passenger side channel provided for this, got the power for the control head from the police package acessory fuse block under the glove compartment, and ran the A+ lead to the battery through a big factory grommet in the fire wall. no strobes, wig wags, spotlights,or sirens though, cause i'm not a hamsexy geek.

[Bill, KD0HG]

A bootlegger's turn uses the parking brake, which is completely independent of the ABS system.

My Crown Vic does bootlegger's turns very well, thank you

I was thinking that stomping on the parking brake while the vehicle is in motion could engage the traction-control part of the ABS or do something else weird with the braking electronics so you wouldn't be able to fully control how the rear wheels locked up. Like it might apply braking to the rear wheel that it sensed was turning faster than the other.
OTOH, how could someone sell a police car that couldn't properly execute emergency maneuvers?

My pickup truck has ABS and I hate it. It's a vile thing when trying to stop fast on an unpaved road, you can't do a straight, controlled slide when you need or want to.

[W2VW]

A bootlegger's turn uses the parking brake, which is completely independent of the ABS system.

My Crown Vic does bootlegger's turns very well, thank you

I was thinking that stomping on the parking brake while the vehicle is in motion could engage the traction-control part of the ABS or do something else weird with the braking electronics so you wouldn't be able to fully control how the rear wheels locked up. Like it might apply braking to the rear wheel that it sensed was turning faster than the other.
OTOH, how could someone sell a police car that couldn't properly execute emergency maneuvers?

My pickup truck has ABS and I hate it. It's a vile thing when trying to stop fast on an unpaved road, you can't do a straight, controlled slide when you need or want to.

The antilock has nothing to say about the parking brake because it is run directly by the parking brake cable on this vehicle. The antilock modulates hydraulic pressure to the wheel cylinders/calipers as supplied from the service pedal.

[AJ1G]

Well, I guess octae doesnt have a significant affect on my 98 Volvo XC MPG.  Tanked up with 91 octane (10% eathanol) prior to trucking out to the Mil Radio Collectors Group meeting in Gilbert PA Friday.  Wanted to have high octane in there for best use of the turob boost in the hills enroute.  Ended up getting over 26 MPG avg on the way out over about 240 miles of mostly Interstate driving with a heavliy BA laden car.  Got over 20 MPG locally out there driving to top of Mt Pocono (over 2000 feet) and back down with the same load. By the top of the mountain going up, local avg MPG was down to about 18, but made it back up on the way down.

On the run home last night, got just shy of 28 MPG average, with 28 showing on the trip computer on ocassion.  Attribute that to being held to less than 65  a lot by traffic conditions.  Seems like 65-70 is optimum cruising speed for best fuel efficiency in the XC.

[WA1GFZ]

Well I finally gave injector cleaner a try. Second tank of gas and the mileage is back up to near 20 MPG from under 19. I also notice the black exhaust pipe
turning gray a bit. A $3 can of cleaner is going to be part of my oil change procedure. 

[W1QWT]

Well I finally gave injector cleaner a try.

My college age daughter was P&M'ing to me that her car was running lousy.
I took it for a ride and it seemed ok to me. Well she's had it for 50K miles and never tuned it up so I figured her old man should help her out.
First I put a can of injector cleaner in the tank and then I tried to replace the plugs. Well on her 93 NIssan they have the plugs under the valve cover.
I immediately lost my plug socket down in there and it took me 30 minutes to fish it out. Figured I'd wait till I could get a new gasket to take the thing off first. Well then the next day the car started stalling and running real lousy. She took took it to a real mechanic unbeknownst to me. When I paid the $180 bill he said the injector cleaner released a whole bunch of goo that plugged up the fuel filter. He said the injector cleaner is good but should be done on a regular basis.
Ofcourse he also finished my plug job and replaced the plug wires along with the filter and patched the muffler.
Well the bright side is she can get to school now.
 

[WA1GFZ]

Trip to Hostraders across up RT. 91 at about 75 MPH  RT9 hills just over 20 MPG on 87 gas.. Not bad for full size truck with 5.3 V8

My best ever was just under 21 MPG with 89 gas.

A couple cans of injector cleaner was well worth the price. Today we seem to just change the oil and fill the windshield washer. 2 cans of injector cleaner bought me over 1 MPG.

[W2VW]

Here's my solution to high fuel prices.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1,1&item=4573892292&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWN%3AIT

Gonna stuff this into the Cadillac time machine. Still need the digital speedometer head to make it play. 

[WA1GFZ]

Dave,
I'm afraid to look remembering the 500 CI in a Firebird.