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R388 Nasty




 
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ka4koe
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« on: February 07, 2013, 09:13:26 AM »

I just received an R388. It works but the top chassis where the tube sockets, etc., is absolutely filthy. Its also MFP coated. What is the best way to clean this sucker. The PTO can is filthy as well.

Thanks

PHILIP
KA4KOE
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WBear2GCR
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« Reply #1 on: February 07, 2013, 03:20:52 PM »


Sorry, what is "MFP"?

It sort of depends on what the stuff is that is making it dirty.

If it is just "normal" dust/grime, then I'd go at it with a soft rag and something like
Fantastik to break down the greasy part...

Ordinarily I'd do a full rinse in a bathtub, but the dial might be harmed by that.

You might remove the drum and the S meter and do a wash & rinse followed by a period of serious drying. I'd suggest ~125 degrees in the oven for about 2-3 hours... or a few days on a hot radiator, or something similar to make 100% certain there is zero residual moisture inside any cans or xfmrs.

The bottom of the chassis is treated with anti moisture and anti fungal coating...

How about a nice couple of jpegs?

              _-_-

PS. the real answer is that it is hopeless, and you should send the unit to me for proper disposal...
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ke7trp
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« Reply #2 on: February 07, 2013, 04:11:58 PM »

Dishwasher is best.   Remove racks and make sure nobody is home when you run the cycle Smiley Ran a few nationals through the "heavy pots and pans" cycle. Came out spotless.

Brush and simple green or mild soap with hose is next best.  Get some cheap paint brushes and go to town on it.  slowly rise by hand or light flow on hose.

Either way, Rinse the radio with "baby" water from the grocery or drug store. at least a few gallons. otherwise, you can get corrosion from the tap water.  Then, Set out in Sun for a few days to really dry, or use a space heater or oven at low temp. 

Replace the electrolytics and yer good to go.  done this many many times. if you are worried about something getting wet, remove it, or cover in plastic wrap/bags and rubber bands. You can control the water flow... to keep the water off the POTS and PTO.

I did this to many radios over the years with great results including my still in service R390.  It was in a barn for 20 years with no top on it. It had about an inch of dust, black silt inside. it almost looked like it was near a Chop saw.. Just covered in black sand type grime.

It was this, or the scrap heap.

C
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KA0HCP
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« Reply #3 on: February 07, 2013, 04:55:46 PM »

MFP = military fungus protection (coating)

Simple Green is quite corrosive to aluminum.   While I don't have any experience with Collins gear, I use dilute Krud Kutter, available at hardware stores to clean my radios.  Quite gentle, yet very thorough.  Best stuff I've found for removing nicotine and mold/mildew
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ke7trp
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« Reply #4 on: February 07, 2013, 05:02:14 PM »

I had several SP600s with that coating. They are gone now.  A total pain to work on and solder with all that junk.  Bad odor and it would also flake off.  A mess. I wont buy a radio with that junk on it now.

Good point to the simple green.  I dilute it so maybe thats why I got good results. Maybe just mild soap is better.  Take no chances.   

C
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KA0HCP
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« Reply #5 on: February 07, 2013, 05:06:54 PM »

MFP probably is more correctly  Mold & Fungus Protection

I haven't seen any formula for this stuff, but imagine it probably has some nasty chemicals we wouldn't touch or breath if we knew what it was.
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KA0HCP
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« Reply #6 on: February 07, 2013, 05:16:16 PM »

http://forums.qrz.com/showthread.php?22632-Anti-Fungal-Coating-Solvent

the last post in this thread is one of the most logical approaches I have seen.  I too have suspicions that there are some heavy metals in the coatings.

I think he makes a very good point that trying to remove the MFP wholesale will probably have some damaging effects on the radio.
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ke7trp
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« Reply #7 on: February 07, 2013, 05:17:54 PM »

It has copper naphthenate in it.  Not good.  Glad I got rid of those rigs. When you solder a terminal that stuff would burn and make a nasty odor.  Had to open a window and turn on a fan. 

C
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w3jn
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« Reply #8 on: February 07, 2013, 05:35:24 PM »

Remove the meter and dial drum, and any bakelite parts (knobs, escutcheon, etc) then take it outside and hose it down.

Then spray with Westley's whitewall cleaner, use a toothbrush to scrub as much as you can.  Rinse very well, then let dry (preferably in the hot sun) for a week or so.
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WBear2GCR
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« Reply #9 on: February 07, 2013, 07:17:39 PM »


Yes, yes, get rid of those rigs. Immediately.

I can *dispose* of them.
As an added bonus I will pay for the shipping to here for proper disposal.

            _-_-
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RolandSWL
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« Reply #10 on: February 07, 2013, 08:58:34 PM »

1. SCOPE
1.1 Scope. This specification covers one type of moisture-and-fungus-resistant varnish consisting of a para-phenyl phenol-formaldehyde resin in combination with tung oil and suitable solvents which has been made fungi static by the addition of 7.0 +/- 1 .0 percent salicylanilide or one percent copper 8-quinolinolate, for the treatment of assembled communications, electronic, and associated electrical equipment.

From a military document dated 1969.

Roland...................
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KA0HCP
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« Reply #11 on: February 07, 2013, 10:07:02 PM »

Oh, is that all?  Sounds like it might be good on ice cream!

ahem.

Copper 8-quinolinolate was introduced in 1956, so is unlikely to have been used before that.   It is used to treat wood, and is approved for use in farming in contact with foodstuffs and vegetables.  Mild skin irritation is possible according to notes.

Salicylanilide is derived from the base for Aspirin (Salycylic acid) and Aniline (used to make aniline dyes, which are kind of nasty).  It and a number of variants are or have been used as antifungals, anti-worm, and antiseptics, primarily in topical (skin) treatments and soaps.   Comment: Don't put it in your mouth, wash your hands afterwards and you probably won't have problems.

Comment: Military radio manuals emphasize using solvents to clean solder joints of MFP before working.  This is good advice for effective soldering and to reduce exposure to whatever is in that particular MFP solution.  I would also recommend minimizing breathing the fumes.

bill
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ka4koe
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« Reply #12 on: February 08, 2013, 07:54:40 AM »

I will post pix when I get back from Orlando this weekend. Hopefully I can pick up a Viking valiant II.
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Todd, KA1KAQ
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« Reply #13 on: February 08, 2013, 09:22:47 AM »

I've had good luck washing off MFP with hot water and soap, totally by mistake.

You find it on a lot of mil gear. Not a big issue to deal with, just follow some basic, common sense practices:

 - don't lick or eat the stuff, put your fingers in your mouth after handling it, or work on it with an open wound

 - clean off solder connections thoroughly before attempting to repair (adequate airflow is a good idea with any soldering)

As Bill says, it's all outlined in the military manuals of the day. There are indeed some nasty compounds involved, but that could also be said of the paint, electrolytic or oil-filled caps, etc. Some people are frightened at the thought, which means more gear for everyone else.  Wink
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