Transformer tragedy - repaired

[KE6DF]

I bought a VM-4 mod transformer off ebay. Listed as new, and unused condition.

Anyway, the package came today. Very poor packing.

It looks like it has been dropped on one end and all the terminals broken and the bakelite terminal board bashed in.

See pictures below.

It was a perfect condition unused 70 year old transformer just as listed.

I think it was insured by USPS, but I'm so disgusted I may just pitch it into the dumpster today so I don't have to look at it -- and not even file the claim and end up getting pissed off further.

Dave

[W2PFY]

Well may I please suggest you calm down . Have some dip I know you can fix it. Way too good to toss away

I don't have any bakelite but may have some other material. Measure it and when I am at my camp tomorrow, I'll see what I have.

[w8khk]

Don't be too hasty to dumpster the transformer.....

Back in the late 70's I chose to scrap an entire modulator deck that had a VM-3 bolted to it.  To this day I still regret letting that go, but I didn't think I would ever need an AM rig.  How wrong I was!

If the transformer windings are not damaged, it should be a simple task to make a new bakelite or plexiglas plate, install new insulators, and label the terminals.  The transformer should still be good as new.  Hold off until you are no longer as upset as you are now, and build that classic AM rig.  

Even if you filed a claim and got reimbursed, it is not likely you would find another transformer of comparable quality for the amount you receive for the claim.   Good luck!

[KM1H]

Send it here, Ive a pair of GU-81M's asking for it

The insulators are standard and bakelite is cheap at Home Depot or lust use Lexan/Plexiglass.
The tweaked frame Id leave alone as its cast iron and may not survive messing with

Carl

[WA1GFZ]

Fill the frame cracks in with car repair fiberglass and fix the contacts as Carl suggests. Make a big stink with shipper.
It doesn't look that bad. It wasn't packed properly.

[KE6DF]

There are no cracks or dents or even scratches in the frame.

Those overly thick end bells survived just fine.

As far as I can tell with an Ohm meter, the windings seem OK.

I'll know more after I take the broken bakelite terminal block off.

I have another mod trans (a UTC LS-67) that requires a heizing reactor (no gap in the core).

It's a little larger physically than this VM-4.

I suppose I could build a rig around the LS-67 and use this broken VM-4 as the heizing reactor as it has a gapped core.

Putting the two windings with undamaged terminals on the other side of the VM-4 in series gives me 47hy on my LC meter and that's probably about right.

Anyway, I'll fix it and use it for something other than dumpster ballast.

Dave

[Bill, KD0HG]

Chill, dude! Automotive Bondo body filler will fix up the end just fine. Get the glass fiber filled variety, it's like Kryptonite. You get about 5 minutes to work the stuff after mixing with hardener, so get your ducks all in a row first. You'll have something to be proud of.

Bill

[Todd, KA1KAQ]

Well Dave, to paraphrase Bubba - "I feel your pain". Had a similar issue 5 years back with a modulation transformer for one of my transmitters:

http://amfone.net/Amforum/index.php?topic=11848.25

The big difference was, it was well-packed and FedWrex managed to trash it anyhow, including breaking one of the cast iron end frames. I was able to get it re-welded and the fellow who had just rewound the transformer confirmed that it was electrically undamaged.

Definitely do not toss it. Get your documentation set and deal with the shipper to get compensated. When I did it, they required something to confirm its value (in my case, a 2004 online Dahl listing served the purpose), and photos of the packaging and damage. Take good clear photos so they can't squirm out of it as being previously damaged.

One caveat: if it was indeed poorly packed, you'll be SOL with the shipper and left to get a refund from the seller. Hopefully you can reach an agreeable price so it doesn't get tossed.

That's a nice piece of iron that can be repaired fairly easily with a little time, a few insulators, a piece of bakelite(plenty of online sources), and some elbow grease. Transformers like that are few and far between, it's definitely worth saving. As others have said - fix it and you'll be using and enjoying it in no time.

[WBear2GCR]

Silly to use the VM-4 as a Heising reactor, imo.

The LS-67 may be a better piece of iron, so perhaps going with it is not a bad idea.

The VM-4's end plate should not be too difficult to replace/rebuild.

Otoh, you could sell it pretty easily and recoup your $$ quite a bit. I'd fab a bit of bakelite or black plexi and have it engraved, quite a few places have engravers these days, reassemble the whole thing... remember, they put it together, right? Or you could sell it as-is...

Don't panic!

Of course the fellow who boxed it was a typical ebay imbecile... I always try to send them a message with the proper recipe for packing. I just got a $700 piece of test gear literally thrown into a box with *nothing* other than a few air pillows off the side... luckily it survived the trip because it was made so well, AND it was worth one whole lot more than that IF it was in working condition (which it turned out that it is).

Oh, and if that was ebay and paypal and the seller was "verified" you can get ur money back without dealing with the shipper's insurance (which goes to the seller anyhow) just by making a claim. So SHOOT SOME CLEAR PIX of the BOX and the DAMAGE!!

                   _-_-bear

[w1vtp]

There are other choices other than bakelite.  G10 fiberglass, phenolic material.  Let it be a learning experience while trying to recoup your $$.  It's a big disappointment to be sure but that can be fixed.  Heck, I'd be interested it the beastie if you want to unload it.  Just PM me.

You can fix it.

GL, Al

[The Slab Bacon]

I feel your pain and dissapointment, but.................................

If you can't fix that transformer, you don't deserve to operate the rig that would use it! ! ! !

A piece of 1/8" or 3/16" lexan from any hardware store will remake the bakelite panel very easily! ! ! ! !  The whole repair, including replacing the broken porcelains shouldn't take you much longer than an hour.

That style VM4's arent that easily findable, now suck it up and just fix it! ! ! !

[N7BDY]

Thats why I'm reluctant to buy off ebay anymore .      I bought a nice old Heathkit transmitter a year ago from a ham  ( who should have known better because he said he sold stuff all the time )  paid 30 or 40 bucks shipping costs and it was damaged during shipping .  Reason ... because the idiot put it in a cardboard box with a bit of bubble wrap around it .  A child would have known better .  Same thing as you ...... was mint until it went through the mail .  I dont blame the shipper , it was the guy who packaged and sent it .  Calm down .... let the anger burn off and turn in a claim .  You have a certain time frame depending on what shipper was used ,  get the check ,  and repair it . Doesnt look too bad really ,  it's just the heartache of it . 

It pisses you off .... but what can ya do ?  Sometimes they come through the mail unscathed and sometimes they dont .  Even when you stress on the seller  to pack it VERY well , they often dont .  Once they get your money , you are on your own .

N7BDY
Bob

[KE6DF]

I wonder where is a good place to get porcelain insulators similar to the ones that are there?

It looks like three or four are broken and the others OK, but if I can't find the same ones, I'll probably replace them all so it looks consistent.

The current bakelite is broken into too many piece to try gluing it.

I have a UTC power transformer with the same insulators, and one of them was broken when I got it, so I glued it and used it for the CT which will be grounded anyway.

I guess I can view this as a chance to learn how to work with Lexan (drill and cut it) or whatever I can find to replace the panel.

[WBear2GCR]

Phenolic or better still G-10 (the green pcb material) are best bets because they will not crack when being drilled, as with Lexan. Although Lexan is pretty rugged. I'd use a flat spade bit, a wood bit, for drilling Lexan or acrylic. Drill press best/required.

You could paint the G-10 black if you wanted to - but I'd skip that since there is HV there, and black paint contains carbon black, so it might make a leakage path, probably not, but...

You can buy mail order from a variety of places.
Hobby shops may have it.
Home improvement stores won't have G-10, maybe they have phenolic.

You can get away with PVC sheet in ~0.200 thickness or so...

Someone here might be able to send you a piece of something for all I know...

Porcelain feed throughs? measure 'em up and look online?

                           _-_-bear

[K3YA]

Granger sells phenolic and a host of other suitable materials in reasonable quantities.  I would super glue the insulators  together if no significant chunks are missing.  Congratulations of finding such a rare modulation transformer!

[KM1H]

I wonder where is a good place to get porcelain insulators similar to the ones that are there?

Fleabay, where else?

[ke7trp]

Upsetting..  I agree.  Fix it the best you can.  Ding the seller for poor packing. 

C

[John K5PRO]

I have a VM4 that indicates there is breakdown inside, when it was only driven with a pair of 6CA7s and had 850 volts across the windings. Maybe you'd be interested in getting it and use the terminals from it, all are good?

[KE6DF]

I have a VM4 that indicates there is breakdown inside, when it was only driven with a pair of 6CA7s and had 850 volts across the windings. Maybe you'd be interested in getting it and use the terminals from it, all are good?

That would be great, John.

I'll send you a PM

Dave

[KM1H]

Or get me the dimensions of the insulators, take one out, take photos of the inside also alont with major dimensions. I might even have some alternatives on hand as long as you dont care about a "matched set".

I can also reference a couple of manufacturers catalogs

[Opcom]

Mayb you can resolve it with the seller. If not, lodge your complaint before the ebay protection expires, send 'em a written bill for$50 or $100 for repairs. USPS will generally deny claims stating that it was not packed right. Or just fix it and go on.. As long as it is good it's not a waste, just an expense. Time to look for a set of stand-offs to match.

[The Slab Bacon]

just FWIW, I just recently sold 2 receivers to a buyer up in 1-land. I did not want to ship them. One was a pristine - mint HQ-150 and the other was a well beat but good working HQ-140X. At his request I reluctantly took them to a UPS "Pack and Ship" store and had them pack them. I also insured them for a high value so if they did destroy them we would both make money on it.

Well..................They arrived intact and OK-FINE!! I guess the difference was having them pack them made them responsible for safe passage.

Or, did we just get lucky? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?

[W3GMS]

This shipping subject has been beat to death but when things are packed properly they generally arrive in good shape.  I have shipped several items over the past couple of months with various carriers and they arrived in excellent shape.  For something that has some weight to it, I double box the goods. On the first box I allow at least 3 inches between the box and the item with lots of packing material to fill the voids. Then I put that in a bigger box with at least 3 inches between the outer box and the inner box with packing material filling the foids.  I use good bubble packing around the item and then fill the rest up with those peanuts and make sure they are settled out.  Yes, it cost a bit more and takes some more time but it gets to its new owner in great shape.  Never use old boxes, spend the money and get new boxes from a box store that are rated for the job.

I look at the Modulation transformer and its obvious that the insulators were never protected.  If a smaller box was placed over the insulators that would have gone a long way in protecting them.  As Frank said, if you don't want to take the time to do it right, have someone that does know do the job!

Joe, W3GMS     

[KA0HCP]

http://www.daburn.com/10-58ceramicfeed-thruinsulators.aspx

Daburn has all the old style ceramics.

[N0WEK]

When I ship something like a transformer I'll screw or bolt the thing to a 2 x 6 or 8 and then pack it, or just keep going and screw a crate together around it. I've usually got plenty of scrap plywood and such around as well as a table saw. I over pack the hell out of anything I ship, I've never had anything get dinged.

I fly for one of the FedEx Feeder operators and watch the terrible packing jobs go by on the loading belt every morning.