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Author Topic: Vic 2  (Read 35031 times)
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KE7KPB
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« on: March 20, 2012, 08:55:29 PM »

After a very busy winter I finally got back to the am station I trying to put together.
I do have a question on the vic 2, I was working on.  I would like to upgrade the audio on the transmitter and keep the transmitter as original as possible with out doing surgery on it.
Thanks for all your help .
If it doesn't glow. It's not a radio
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Pete, WA2CWA
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« Reply #1 on: March 20, 2012, 11:05:40 PM »

What's a Vic 2?
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kb3rdt
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« Reply #2 on: March 21, 2012, 06:49:31 AM »

Think it's a Johnson Viking 2
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KE7KPB
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« Reply #3 on: March 21, 2012, 08:12:10 AM »

Johnson Viking 2
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The Slab Bacon
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« Reply #4 on: March 21, 2012, 09:09:46 AM »

that is a tough question, it depends on what you consider "surgery"
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KL7OF
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« Reply #5 on: March 21, 2012, 10:18:27 AM »

triode connect the 807 modulators......feed them with outboard audio..You will bypass and leave the stock speech circuits intact...that way the only mods are a few clipped wires, wiring that can be put back to original if you so desire, and a hole to mount a jack to feed the audio in....
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KM1H
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« Reply #6 on: March 21, 2012, 03:31:48 PM »

I wouldnt bother with any outboard crap, its still only a 100W output rig on most days and the onboard iron is the limiting factor. It would be a shame to butcher it for a minimal gain.

Id do the ER mods in June and July 1998 and also look at the August issue. The mods come in a couple of flavors, pick the one that works for you.

Carl
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WD8BIL
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« Reply #7 on: March 21, 2012, 04:22:27 PM »

The ER mods are great as Carl points out.
There are also mods on the AMWINDOW (link above) that work great too. I have this one in the famous Viking Bud (1)!

http://www.amwindow.org/tech/htm/viking2.htm
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w1vtp
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« Reply #8 on: March 21, 2012, 04:31:50 PM »

The ER mods are great as Carl points out.
There are also mods on the AMWINDOW (link above) that work great too. I have this one in the famous Viking Bud (1)!

http://www.amwindow.org/tech/htm/viking2.htm


I believe this is the mod that has been done on my V1.  Only think I might want to do on mine is regulate the screens of the 807s

Al
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KE7KPB
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« Reply #9 on: March 21, 2012, 07:44:33 PM »

Hello everyone.
I'm kinda like a purest when it comes to radio equipment but there is always room for a little improvement.
I do like the 12ax7 mod so I might do that mod and see how it turns out. After the great help on the this site I do have a better understanding on the Viking 2. Not great but better than I did when I started. To answer Slab of bacon, Surgery was already done as far as a total recap and repair of other problems. I think this transmitter was rode hard and put away wet.
I do have another question, Is it better to have the Johnson electronic T/R switch or the old Dow Key?


* 2012-01-08_07-48-24_544.jpg (1260.24 KB, 1456x2592 - viewed 767 times.)
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ke7trp
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« Reply #10 on: March 21, 2012, 08:06:15 PM »

A tube change in that HRO would be an all day saturday job.

C
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KM1H
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« Reply #11 on: March 21, 2012, 08:43:33 PM »

I went with the SS regulator Al since my 20K bleeder was already open and I wanted to redo that PS anyway, its really just about mandatory for a tetrode AB modulator.

Im using the Johnson TR on the V-II and a Dow-Key on the V-I but that will be replaced by a B&W TR when I get to it

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WA1GFZ
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« Reply #12 on: March 21, 2012, 08:47:31 PM »

I did a zener regulator with a pair of 10 watt stud mounted parts. Screenn voltage is rock solid.
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KE7KPB
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« Reply #13 on: March 21, 2012, 11:27:09 PM »

Since this was a kit radio I was wondering if one should go through and check for tightness on all of the screws.
Tomorrow I will be taking a picture of the transmitted signal on my ifr1200s and put it up on the forum so you guys can see what the transmitter is doing and maybe you can see if there is something wrong with it before I put it on the air. Is this possible?
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Steve - K4HX
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« Reply #14 on: March 21, 2012, 11:49:37 PM »

An outboard audio driver will require ZERO butchering. Why do you post such silliness?



I wouldnt bother with any outboard crap, its still only a 100W output rig on most days and the onboard iron is the limiting factor. It would be a shame to butcher it for a minimal gain.

Id do the ER mods in June and July 1998 and also look at the August issue. The mods come in a couple of flavors, pick the one that works for you.

Carl
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KL7OF
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« Reply #15 on: March 22, 2012, 12:45:20 AM »

An outboard audio driver will require ZERO butchering. Why do you post such silliness?



I wouldnt bother with any outboard crap, its still only a 100W output rig on most days and the onboard iron is the limiting factor. It would be a shame to butcher it for a minimal gain.

Id do the ER mods in June and July 1998 and also look at the August issue. The mods come in a couple of flavors, pick the one that works for you.

Carl
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ke7trp
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« Reply #16 on: March 22, 2012, 12:54:43 AM »

Steve, Did not hear ya on 20 today. I called for ya.  Maybe tomorrow?

Here I was thinking he was talking about a Vic20

http://oldcomputers.net/vic20.html


C
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KL7OF
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« Reply #17 on: March 22, 2012, 11:28:03 AM »

triode connect the 807 modulators......feed them with outboard audio..You will bypass and leave the stock speech circuits intact...that way the only mods are a few clipped wires, wiring that can be put back to original if you so desire, and a hole to mount a jack to feed the audio in....

I use a homebrew 6B4G x 2 speech amp to drive the grids of the triode connected 807's thru a multi tap stancor audio transformer.....Lots of audio...I run the finals at about 80 watts and get 100 percent or better pos peaks....Sounds like a BC TX...works for me..solidstate audio drivers will work too...All the johnson speech circuits remain untouched and unused.
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KE7KPB
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« Reply #18 on: March 22, 2012, 11:49:19 AM »

With all of the mods for the audio, It doesn't sound like Johnson did a very good job on that part of the transmitter.
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KM1H
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« Reply #19 on: March 22, 2012, 12:47:49 PM »

Quote
An outboard audio driver will require ZERO butchering. Why do you post such silliness?


Well, if you bother to read post 5 I consider clipping leads and drilling a hole unnecessary butchering that adds no real benefit over minimally invasvive internal changes. YMMV and youre welcome to add another round of your silliness if the urge is overwhelming. Cheesy

OTOH my statement was more generic to cover a wide range of Viking butchery that has been done in the name of "improved audio"

Quote
With all of the mods for the audio, It doesn't sound like Johnson did a very good job on that part of the transmitter.

Considering that the ARRL was on the warpath about minimizing audio bandwidth and penalizing those who didnt comply by not running their ads what you got was the result. The only postwar TX I know of that sounded good as built was the HT-9 and that was soon replaced anyway.

Carl
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ke7trp
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« Reply #20 on: March 22, 2012, 01:20:25 PM »

To each his own, I dont like butchering old gear either.  If its trashed like that Ranger that Steve recently built with the audio board, then heck, Go for it.  He made something great out of a radio that looked like it was in a swamp.  But if the radio is decent looking, I would rather have it working as it was intended, Then do some simple audio mods.  Just my 2 cents.

c
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The Slab Bacon
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« Reply #21 on: March 22, 2012, 02:33:49 PM »

To each his own, I dont like butchering old gear either.  If its trashed like that Ranger that Steve recently built with the audio board, then heck, Go for it.  He made something great out of a radio that looked like it was in a swamp.  But if the radio is decent looking, I would rather have it working as it was intended, Then do some simple audio mods.  Just my 2 cents.
c

I have to totally agree on this one, but.................Most V-2s I have ever seen look like they've been pulled out of a swamp with all of the paint peeling off of them and a higher than usual amount of rust / corrosion on the chassis. I dont know if it was crappy paint or the copper plating, but most V-2s I've ever seen look basically like a fugitive from the scrap recycler. A clean, pristeen one is rather rare to find.

that being said, they are prime candidates for a little experimental modifying. They also usually come by often and cheap. For a neophyte, they are a good starting point to get your feet wet working on and modifying a boatanchor rig. And lets face it, there are more mods for a V-2 than there are recipes for "grandpa's secret BBQ sauce".
The undersides of the chassis are also quite open and roomy, making them easy to work on, especially for the beginner.

I never figgered why they used a couple of pentodes for the low level audio circuits. I do like the 12AX7 / 6C4 audio mod, it is simple and easily reversable. (Unless you want to sound like Pete with a clothspin on your nose). That is a simple and good mod for a beginner to attempt. and it is always successful, giving the neophyte a bit of confidence to try more.

If you butcher one up trying to hot rod it, it's no big deal, there are tons of them out there. They make for a good learning experience.

I most likely wouldn't do it to a rarer or more valuable rig, but V-2s are common as dirt and pretty easy to un butcher if one desires.
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KM1H
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« Reply #22 on: March 22, 2012, 05:01:22 PM »

Quote
I never figgered why they used a couple of pentodes for the low level audio circuits. I do like the 12AX7 / 6C4 audio mod, it is simple and easily reversable
.

Considering that you have to hack a 7 pin hole for a 9 pin socket its not easily reversible, and besides I dont see the need for that mod if youre not trying for the moon. The original pair of 6AU6's modified per the ER article is all thats needed. If you really want another 10-15% of audio so you can push the 6146's into an earlier grave then give a 6J6 a try and it should give enough audio into the new driver transformer. ER went with a 12AU7 mounted underneath for their Level 2 mod and left most of the Level 1 mods alone which allows you to see if Level 1 works well for you or you want the next level.

The stock mod transformer was designed around the 100W spec of the VIK-1 4D32 and notice that Johnson didnt raise the AM spec to 120W for the VIK-II...I suspect they knew what they were doing.
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Steve - K4HX
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« Reply #23 on: March 22, 2012, 06:15:54 PM »

None of that is required for an outboard driver. To posit such is a red herring. An outboard driver is the least invasive way to obtain excellent audio. The rig can be returned to bone stock in a matter of minutes. This is so obvious it's not worth arguing about. I've done it on a Viking II and numerous other transmitters. It's so easy a caveman can do it.  Grin



Quote
An outboard audio driver will require ZERO butchering. Why do you post such silliness?


Well, if you bother to read post 5 I consider clipping leads and drilling a hole unnecessary butchering that adds no real benefit over minimally invasvive internal changes. YMMV and youre welcome to add another round of your silliness if the urge is overwhelming. Cheesy

OTOH my statement was more generic to cover a wide range of Viking butchery that has been done in the name of "improved audio"

Quote
With all of the mods for the audio, It doesn't sound like Johnson did a very good job on that part of the transmitter.

Considering that the ARRL was on the warpath about minimizing audio bandwidth and penalizing those who didnt comply by not running their ads what you got was the result. The only postwar TX I know of that sounded good as built was the HT-9 and that was soon replaced anyway.

Carl
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KM1H
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« Reply #24 on: March 22, 2012, 08:08:06 PM »

Steve, your as entitled to your opinion as I am to mine. Id also expected more out of you than childish insults.

IMO adding an external driver which has to be built or modified is a last resort. Changing a few components in the rig is simple and you dont have to worry about RF problems either. An overhaul will require access underneath to replace paper and electrolytic caps anyway.



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