Fundamentalist Radio Extremism

[W2VW]

I think the RA-17s may not have had the best of quality in parts. Layout sure isn't restoration friendly. At least they had a brilliant design concept.

[W7TFO]

This is a form of fundamentalism I can live with

Yeah sure, solid state is more efficient and easier to source today.

Yeah sure, chips can make a radio signal hold still and be heard much easier.

Yeah sure, tubes with handles make more poot per pound than glass.


No argument there.  But a lot of things like that don't excite me, either.


Gathering parts for homebrewing a glowing 450TH rig does.

Looking at an in-storage 9000 lb 1940 WECo watercooled does.

Working on my new '36 SP-10 Hammarlund does.

All for the purpose of pleasing me by working anyone I can with any kind of AM rig they like.

73DG

[W2VW]

I actually had that happen one night when a HV connector blew apart on the 4X1 rig!! Someone was sitting right next to the cabinet when it went off like an M-80.
He just about jumped out of his skin, and I fell out of my chair laughing    

A couple years ago we had some suits come out to visit a remote site where a used transmitter had just been installed.

I was there to see it operating for the first time.

Lit it off and the drive relay was locked out due to mis wiring.

The suits were yucking it up about 4 feet away from the transmitter. Did I mention the tube was not fully conditioned and was very likely to arc? No. I didn't mention it to the suits either.

It was only a matter of time before the thryatron crowbar would go BAAAP with the soaring voltage due to no load. It was right up at 40 kv : )

T'was a fine day indeed.

[K5UJ]

there is no substitute for high level plate modulation.

PREACH IT BROTHER!!!

[Opcom]

Have been watching the threads on the technical side about AME and SDR stuff. Have to say as a truly committed Luddite that there is no substitute for high level plate modulation. PDM in solid state may be the equal for transistors or FET finals but the people with their balanced modulators, IF filters, stages of questionable linear response and ALC just can't get the feel of a high powered vintage vacuum tube transmitter. It's like the difference between riding a Harley and a Honda, their Bothe good bikes but one will never be like the other, and as far as the SDR people and their computer that's masquerading as a radio and their I and Q encoders, don’t even get me started on that! The above are my own opinions and are not meant as a condemnations or slurs on others but having read a comment posted the other day about using triodes in amplifiers and thinking about it have to say I have had more fun playing around with the huge inefficient 833 triode modulators and PA in my old RCA then with much of the work I have to do on modern equipment. For me the size and simplicity of working with the old stuff far exceeds and satisfaction that can be derived from downloading a new app or writing couple new lines of code for a SDR. But that’s just me and everyone is entitled to their own views, will be curious to see others views just remember to be broad minded and respect others.

Right On man!

[KB2WIG]

Now give me that old time modulation,
 give me that old time plate modulation
  give me that old time plate modulation
   And its good enough for me.


It was good for our muvers,...
 Makes me love everybody,...
  It was good for our faders
   It was good for Time's children
     It was good for Paul and Bacon
      It will do when I  crap out



God bless Mel Gibson

[KM1H]

Variety is the spice of life.

Yup, but up to a point for me. I have plate modulated, carrier control modulated, and a TS-950SD driving a LK-500ZC linear. Power ranges from about 25W to whatever I want.

There are no make believe radios or amps here!

The nice thing about home brew is that you can build 3 rigs in a BC cabinet

Carl

[KA3EKH]

Perhaps I started this thread to goad the SDR people to defend their dogma. It often appears to me that they do promote themselves as the "tip of the spear" and the forefront of Ham radio.  Perhaps they are, Maybe the SDR people and platform will inherit the earth?  But for me to be a fundamentalist is to be leave that AM is High level plate, PDM or perhaps screen modulation of the final stage of a transmitter and received by an envelope detector. Other processes can mimic or create quasi AM, or thru great difficulty attempt to produce AM at lower power levels and amplify it to some useable level. Maybe the balanced modulator and I and Q encoder people will tell you that their wide band low level stuff is just the same but not to me, with fundamentalist high Q technology there are bandwidth limitations and audio characteristics by design to shape the sound. The flat bandwidth SDR people want to do everything in software, yawn. To follow the vehicle analogy the SDR crowd is driving Prius and the fundamentalist 57 Chevys, you tell me what's more fun to drive? A fuel injected small block 283 Chevy coop or a Toyota Prius? Have not yet determined what the AME crowd is driving, maybe Hondas?

[KF1Z]

There's already plenty of threads discussing SDR vs Tubes vs Class-E

It'll  get you no where.

AM is a mode, not a type of gear.

[W2ZE]

here we go again.....

So the real purpose of this thread was to throw out a 3ft high flame because you don't like/understand/care/fear what someone else is doing to get any sort of enjoyment out of running AM?

In case you haven't figured it out by now,let me let you in on a little secret: AM is as much about the people as it is the mode. There are many bright, intelligent and talented people who call themselves AM'ers, who come from all different walks of life. How they choose to generate an AM signal is quite honestly none of your friggin' business. We have people who collect gear from the early 20's to now who write code to make something generate RF. To each his own, so long as the signal is clean with no distortion due to overmodulation and 60 or 120Hz hum on the signal.

Quasi AM? How is a carrier with 2 sidebands quasi AM?

Throwing out flames to "goad" someone to defend how they generate RF is self defeating, alienating, and down right obnoxious. Creating an us vs. them attitude serves no purpose other than to make you feel superior, and no good can come of it, NONE!

A 57 Chevy may be more fun to drive, but a Toyota Prius gets 47 MPG and helps me bring home the bacon to afford the gas in my 57 Chevy!

My 2 pennies and now officially off the soap box.

Mike

[KA3EKH]

It's just a joke, an opportunity to get people writing about their modes. Thought no one would take this stuff seriously! Just poking fun at the concept of extremism and fundamentalism. That’s why this is in the QSO and not the technical section. Sorry if some of my over the top statements offend.
Ray F.

[Pete, WA2CWA]

We take our AM seriously  no matter how smug we are. Great AM is always just a mouse click or two away for many users.    Heavy iron finds it place in the trunk of a 57 Chevy to keep it from sliding off the road.    Been there; done that; technology moves to the 21st century.

[Carl WA1KPD]

I love the sound of a large plate modulated rig that goes "THUNK" when they throw the plate switch and all the background noise disappears and then is followed by full fidelity clean audio!

I love the smell of old warm boatanchors. The gleam of chrome and stainless steel against wrinkle paint renews my spirit.

I admit it's probably a form of mental illness, but I enjoy my perversion. I probably was affected by watching too many "mad scientist" films as a youth.

Captured my thoughts exactly!

[The Slab Bacon]

Yea, But....................................

the AM community is also a social thing as well. we all seem to share enough common interests that we enjoy hanging out together.

The bottom line really is it isn't the gear as much as it is the person behind the mic! ! ! ! ! ! !

Kinda like hangin out at the gin mill with your buddies, but the yl isn't gonna kill you when you get home 'cause you never left.   

[WA1GFZ]

There is this secret way of building an AM transmitter. You hook an audio interstage transformer to the B+ lead of a class C final.

[W2VW]

Plate modulation sure as heck was not the earliest way of making AM.

[The Slab Bacon]

Plate modulation sure as heck was not the earliest way of making AM.

How about some good old "loop modulation"   

[W2VW]

Plate modulation sure as heck was not the earliest way of making AM.

How about some good old "loop modulation"   

Yeah if you ain't burning your lips off you ain't dedicated.

[Ralph W3GL]

  Step back and scream at that loosely packed variable carbon resistor!!!

  Avoid the  blister on the end of the noise... Fun, fun...
 

[kg8lb]

A Honda bike will last a lot longer on the road than a Harley, although they don't make as much noise.

  Not sure that a Honda will outlast a Harley on the road (Worked on a LOT of Hondas here and on the road !). In any event, my 1983 MotoGuzzi just rolled over 198,000 miles and still runs strong . A year round rider, the bike has seen many rides to work in single digit temps. Never let me down. 17 Moto Guzzis here and so far every one a winner .

  If it is all about 21st century technology why AM at all ? It is about AM whatever the era for many of us. Some folks just plain like the old gear, others want to explore different methods. Neither has anything over the other.

[Pete, WA2CWA]

If it is all about 21st century technology why AM at all ? It is about AM whatever the era for many of us. Some folks just plain like the old gear, others want to explore different methods. Neither has anything over the other.

Other then old gear generally requires a lot more space and can be extremely heavy to move around; generally will eat up more electricity; because it's old, it might require more then average repair activity; because of generally much higher DC voltages, electrocution is possible if care and precaution are not taken when using or servicing; because of it's previous storage and environment, it might smell badly when powered up.

[k4kyv]

AM is one aspect of fundamentalist amateur radio.  It doesn't matter whether that means restoring and running "vintage" equipment, or homebrewing plate modulated tube type rigs or solid state class-E.  Amateur radio fundamentalism is not even limited to AM; it can include CW, SSB and other facets as well.

The difference is having an interest in the technology and in learning something. It means working with it, hands-on, especially building one's own from ground up, as opposed to merely spending money to purchase "consumer" electronics appliances in order to "talk", "communicate" or "compete", with little interest in what goes on inside the box.

There are AMers who wouldn't fit into the fundamentalist category.

[kg8lb]

If it is all about 21st century technology why AM at all ? It is about AM whatever the era for many of us. Some folks just plain like the old gear, others want to explore different methods. Neither has anything over the other.

Other then old gear generally requires a lot more space and can be extremely heavy to move around; generally will eat up more electricity; because it's old, it might require more then average repair activity; because of generally much higher DC voltages, electrocution is possible if care and precaution are not taken when using or servicing; because of it's previous storage and environment, it might smell badly when powered up.

  Actually Pete the comment was not in regard to classic VS solid state gear. It was pertaining to the fact that this is just a hobby.
 Most of us are very well aware of the differences and shortcomings of both old and new gear. Many of us have a blend of both old and new gear.
 Most of your points are trivial some are quite overstated and all have pretty good offsets on the other side of the coin. Just a hobby here. Horses take up space and smell bad too. People still have a lot of fun with them.

[W2PFY]

This thread? Too much time on our hands? Aye?

[W1AEX]

I don't know Terry, it's an interesting thread.

As someone above already said, it's a hobby. In my book, that means it should be fun. I find it a bit irksome when I see the AM community sub-dividing itself into categories, with inferred elitism conferred upon this group or that group. There's nothing wrong with being proud of something you have designed, built, modified, repaired, restored, or bought in a box. In my book, how you generate your signal is always a subject of interest, for a few minutes anyway, but that's about it. I love operating AM and have done so for decades. I also enjoy learning about the different methods employed to generate AM, but why limit the experience to one mode? I also enjoy running SSB, CW, FM, RTTY, PSK, and every other obscure mode my privileges offer me. If all you do is operate AM, and you really enjoy it, that's fine, but it certainly doesn't mean you're elite. With so many modes available to us, why limit yourself to a narrow slice when you can have the whole cake?

It's supposed to be fun, and like the Joker said, "Why so seeeeeeerious?"