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Author Topic: Mic for use with 32v2  (Read 16945 times)
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Steve - K4HX
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« Reply #25 on: July 03, 2012, 10:28:13 AM »

Long cords can also roll of the highs in a hi-z situation.
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KM1H
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« Reply #26 on: July 03, 2012, 11:28:04 AM »

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they all can be improved with some work. We're talking about stock radios here.

I tend to question that SX-28 result but Jay would have to comment on what was done to it first.

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Quote from: KM1H on June 27, 2012, 02:06:30 PM
But the others dont short out from just normal use as do the 32V's, just ask the rewinders.


That's a bit misleading. You're assuming today's conditions as 'normal' and applying them to a 60 yr old transmitter. This leaves out the obvious problems involved with aging components, aging insulation, and elevated line voltages. The low voltage transformer is the biggest issue with the 32V series today, having the sizzling 5Z4 and regulator sitting half an inch away with today's elevated line voltage doesn't help. And as you mentioned, Vikings and others have similar problems. Using a different mic or tailoring the audio won't roll back the years. And pounding the snot out of a stock old rig is more likely to cause failure.

Its far from misleading as all BA's have to follow the same path. Some survive at 120-125VAC input and others dont. With all the visibility given to bucking transformers I have a hard time understanding why so many play Russian Roulette. I cant speak for the 32V1 but the later ones are known for audio iron, filter choke plus the LV transformer failures. That one I picked up at Nearfest had replacements in it from decades ago plus good spares were includes.

I said absolutely nothing about Viker iron failures, with good filter caps they seem to last just fine. Now, some bozo trying for extreme audio is asking for the mod iron to sizzle but thats not Johnsons fault.


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Quote from: KM1H on June 29, 2012, 05:46:42 PM
But it still has the ARRL mandated restricted bandpass in stock form as does every other make and model from the mid 40's onward.


Huh? What power did the ARRL have to mandate anything beyond their offices and membership? Numerous transmitters from that time frame seem to prove otherwise. Sounds like a UFO sighting to me. Show us some proof, big guy.
 


Very simple my uninformed friend...they controlled who could run ads. This was when they became fanatically pro SSB and were reacting to all the overwide signal complaints about AMers. So manufacturers were pressured to narrow the bandwidth to, I believe, 3KHz per SB iffn I remember.
The Viking 1 was delayed in delivery because the audio section had to be redesigned.....maybe that pathetic driver iron was part of it

Start by reading all the old CQ's for more info, most cant be found in index searches.

Carl
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Steve - K4HX
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« Reply #27 on: July 03, 2012, 11:57:39 AM »

Pure bunk. The ARRL was not going to turn down ad money. Name the companies that made hi-fi transmitters or non-ARRL approved transmitters that weren't allowed to advertise.




Quote
Very simple my uninformed friend...they controlled who could run ads. This was when they became fanatically pro SSB and were reacting to all the overwide signal complaints about AMers. So manufacturers were pressured to narrow the bandwidth to, I believe, 3KHz per SB iffn I remember.
The Viking 1 was delayed in delivery because the audio section had to be redesigned.....maybe that pathetic driver iron was part of it

Start by reading all the old CQ's for more info, most cant be found in index searches.
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Todd, KA1KAQ
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« Reply #28 on: July 03, 2012, 01:38:00 PM »

I said absolutely nothing about Viker iron failures, with good filter caps they seem to last just fine. Now, some bozo trying for extreme audio is asking for the mod iron to sizzle but thats not Johnsons fault.

Sure ya did:

The Vikings are OK in stock form if you dont run beyond about an 80W carrier and audio to match; otherwise the driver iron folds up.

See? I don't think running them at their rated output could be considered 'extreme'. I'll bet if you cut back the 32V to 75-80w you'll have fewer failures of original components too. It just stands to reason due to the things mentioned previously about elevated line voltage, etc.

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Very simple my uninformed friend...they controlled who could run ads. This was when they became fanatically pro SSB and were reacting to all the overwide signal complaints about AMers. So manufacturers were pressured to narrow the bandwidth to, I believe, 3KHz per SB iffn I remember.
The Viking 1 was delayed in delivery because the audio section had to be redesigned.....maybe that pathetic driver iron was part of it

Start by reading all the old CQ's for more info, most cant be found in index searches.

Don't need to - there are already ample examples of this theory being inaccurate too. Not that the ARRL wasn't eventually pro SSB, we're all certain of that. But as I pointed out in a thread in the QSO section, SSB had yet to become an issue when some manufacturers like Collins were restricting bandwidth on their own, to create more audio punch and sell more radios. Simply a business decision. The KW-1 sold back in the early 50s and started off with much broader audio than it ended up with. If your conspiracy theory is true, why wouldn't they have started with restricted audio from the get-go in 51-52, instead of waiting until half way through the production run? And the Ranger is known for having broader audio out of the box. Did Edgar not get the ARRL memo until the Valiant in '56? What about the Eico 720 from the late 50s/early 60s?

I wasn't there, but everything I've read and heard from others back then says it was merely a case of it being Amateur radio, not broadcast AM. Communication was the goal, so the more punch your audio had and the less wasted in extra lows and highs, the better your chances for being heard. Who wanted to sell a transmitter that sounded wonderful but got lost in the noise?

"It was the one armed man!!!"  Grin
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KM1H
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« Reply #29 on: July 03, 2012, 08:34:16 PM »

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Pure bunk. The ARRL was not going to turn down ad money. Name the companies that made hi-fi transmitters or non-ARRL approved transmitters that weren't allowed to advertise

They didnt lose a penny since it wasnt a sudden decision. The manufacturers had time to react with maybe Collins leading the pack.

Name me one hi fi transmitter after 1950-51. Maybe the real low volume ones werent bothered but CQ had many ads that werent in QST.

If you want to be an ARRL apologist and not do any research thats your choice.
I do know you werent old enough to go to the ARRL conventions in the 60's and hear Halligan and others speaking up in the hospitality rooms at night but I kept my ears open.
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KM1H
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« Reply #30 on: July 03, 2012, 09:19:15 PM »

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Quote from: KM1H on June 27, 2012, 02:06:30 PM
The Vikings are OK in stock form if you dont run beyond about an 80W carrier and audio to match; otherwise the driver iron folds up.


See? I don't think running them at their rated output could be considered 'extreme'. I'll bet if you cut back the 32V to 75-80w you'll have fewer failures of original components too. It just stands to reason due to the things mentioned previously about elevated line voltage, etc.


Folded up doesnt mean failed, I thought you knew more about the teriminology.  Also Im still trying to get it thru your thick bean that the later 32V's had problems before AM died off and yes 125VAC doesnt help these days. But the Vikers dont seem to be bothered nor do most other transmitter brands. Ask Gary what he thinks about Collins iron, I forget his call. http://members.tripod.com/tubes_tubes_tubes/transformerrewindingservice/

Quote
Start by reading all the old CQ's for more info, most cant be found in index searches

Don't need to - there are already ample examples of this theory being inaccurate too. Not that the ARRL wasn't eventually pro SSB, we're all certain of that. But as I pointed out in a thread in the QSO section, SSB had yet to become an issue when some manufacturers like Collins were restricting bandwidth on their own, to create more audio punch and sell more radios. Simply a business decision. The KW-1 sold back in the early 50s and started off with much broader audio than it ended up with. If your conspiracy theory is true, why wouldn't they have started with restricted audio from the get-go in 51-52, instead of waiting until half way through the production run? And the Ranger is known for having broader audio out of the box. Did Edgar not get the ARRL memo until the Valiant in '56? What about the Eico 720 from the late 50s/early 60s?



What examples? All Ive seen so far is chatter.
As far as Collins the obvious answer is that they phased into it rather than scrap costly iron. Im sure the ARRL had agreements. Who cares about the KW-1, they didnt make enough to count anyway.

The Ranger is known for WHAT? Do you have a plotted bandwidth handy or does it just sound better because iron isnt being stressed into saturation?
The Eico 720 was a CW rig for crying out loud and the seperate 730 wasnt anything special as designed, what is its BW? Did the 730 ads run in QST for the years it was offered or was it more a catalog and store item?

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I wasn't there, but everything I've read and heard from others back then says it was merely a case of it being Amateur radio, not broadcast AM. Communication was the goal, so the more punch your audio had and the less wasted in extra lows and highs, the better your chances for being heard. Who wanted to sell a transmitter that sounded wonderful but got lost in the noise?

Not there but you believe everything you hear 3rd hand and more. The fact is that the punch became accepted with the help of many QST editorials and articles drumming it in.

The deep lows were a waste of power and highs didnt affect the talk power, it was bringing up the average percentage that gave the punch. Highs took up some BW but even they were chopped off in many receivers by 1955 or so
Even the fine sounding phasing rigs were restricted to around 3KHz but sounded a lot better than 2.4 to 2.7KHz filter rigs.

When I kick my TS-950SD to about 3300Hz on AM or SSB it also sounds much better.
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Steve - K4HX
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« Reply #31 on: July 05, 2012, 07:23:33 AM »

I didn't think you could name any manufacturers. As I said pure bunk on your part. Next you'll be telling us NASA never went to the moon and it was all the ARRL's fault. What load.

Do some research and get back to us when you have some facts. I'm not interested in conspiracy theories.


Quote
Pure bunk. The ARRL was not going to turn down ad money. Name the companies that made hi-fi transmitters or non-ARRL approved transmitters that weren't allowed to advertise

They didnt lose a penny since it wasnt a sudden decision. The manufacturers had time to react with maybe Collins leading the pack.

Name me one hi fi transmitter after 1950-51. Maybe the real low volume ones werent bothered but CQ had many ads that werent in QST.

If you want to be an ARRL apologist and not do any research thats your choice.
I do know you werent old enough to go to the ARRL conventions in the 60's and hear Halligan and others speaking up in the hospitality rooms at night but I kept my ears open.
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KM1H
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« Reply #32 on: July 05, 2012, 12:11:35 PM »

YAWN

Kiddies sure have little ability at basic research Shocked
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Todd, KA1KAQ
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« Reply #33 on: July 06, 2012, 12:05:31 AM »

Ooooo, that's a harsh generalization there. It's like saying all old fudds are easily confused between opinion and fact, or fantasy and reality. Next thing you know, you'll be watering the house plants with shampoo and someone will be setting all those nice radios out on the curb. Tick tock.  Wink

Maybe the reason people are so curious about your claim is because others have indeed done research and no one has every found anything to it. Folks would still love to see the actual proof of this technical conspiracy you allege. You've offered your fond opinion, but no real facts. You know what they say about opinions.

The interest is there. If you can ever turn up any real documentation, there's a thread in the QSO section referencing your previous mention of it, or you could always start a new one. Since the Technical section is for technical discussions and not conspiracy theories, and since this thread was about the best mic to use with the 32V transmitter before being hijacked, I guess we're done here.
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