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Author Topic: difference between a resonant choke and a swinging choke  (Read 4523 times)
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scottdarling1221
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« on: March 14, 2010, 05:28:45 PM »

What is the difference between these 2 chokes.what type of aplication is each one more appropriate for.
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k4kyv
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Don
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« Reply #1 on: March 14, 2010, 06:11:32 PM »

The resonant choke achieves a high reactance at the ripple frequency by resonating the choke with a parallel capacitor.  The swinging choke achieves high reactance by brute force, using a core with a minuscule gap in the iron so that with low DC current the inductance soars to a high value.

The high reactance is necessary to make the filter act like a choke input filter and not capacitor input. The choke input filter results in better DC voltage regulation  with a variable  load such as a class-B modulator or slopbucket leen-yar. Choke input also results in lower peak rectifier current.

Generally, solid state diodes can handle high peak current, something which can shorten the life of tube type rectifiers.  OTOH, tubes can tolerate occasionally exceeding the peak inverse voltage rating, while this will usually kill solid state diodes immediately the first time it happens.
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Don, K4KYV                                       AMI#5
Licensed since 1959 and not happy to be back on AM...    Never got off AM in the first place.

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scottdarling1221
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« Reply #2 on: March 14, 2010, 06:36:43 PM »

which type would you use for a screen supply in a amplifier mainly used on am.
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k4kyv
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Don
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« Reply #3 on: March 14, 2010, 08:02:21 PM »

I'm not sure how much the screen current would vary under modulation. You could probably just use a smoothing choke and condenser input filter.  With SSB, modulator service or CW you might need to pay more attention to voltage regulation.
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Don, K4KYV                                       AMI#5
Licensed since 1959 and not happy to be back on AM...    Never got off AM in the first place.

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This message was typed using the DVORAK keyboard layout.
http://www.mwbrooks.com/dvorak
scottdarling1221
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« Reply #4 on: March 14, 2010, 08:06:05 PM »

how does .15 uf for the filter 10h for the choke non swinging and 40k for the bleeder so sound.Its a full wave bridge rectifier so i think ill have a 129 hz resonant load with this setup
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scottdarling1221
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« Reply #5 on: March 14, 2010, 08:09:08 PM »

also if a chokes rating says 60 hz can it be used at double the frequency if so what happens to the voltage and current rating and does the h rating change at all
i have a 10H @ 600mA 3100VDC 60Hz choke i was thinking about using
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KM1H
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« Reply #6 on: March 15, 2010, 09:54:19 AM »

For linear service you should use a low impedance regulated screen supply. If SS isnt your thing then use a 572B as the regulator.

If you are really serious about running that tube legally on AM then drop the screen voltage way down and dont worry about regulation, you will have almost no current to deal with.

Carl
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k4kyv
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Don
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« Reply #7 on: March 15, 2010, 10:52:45 AM »

also if a chokes rating says 60 hz can it be used at double the frequency if so what happens to the voltage and current rating and does the h rating change at all
i have a 10H @ 600mA 3100VDC 60Hz choke i was thinking about using

There is nothing critical about the frequency rating of a choke.  Inductance doesn't change significantly with frequency.  Some people successfully use power supply chokes as modulation reactors.  I'm not sure why the manufacturer even puts a frequency rating on a filter choke.

The .15 mfd is probably OK for capacitance.  The question is whether it has high enough voltage rating.  The a.c. voltage rating should be somewhat more (as safety margin) than the peak ripple voltage.  To be on the safe side, make it at least about 50% more than the DC power  supply rating.  Just any old 0.15 mfd capacitor won't do. They tend to blow up very easily. Adequate resonating capacitors are hard to find; that is the reason why resonant filter chokes are so seldom used.  For a typical plate supply, that 0.15 cap would need to be rated at about 4 kv.  Another problem is that capacitance may be substantially different from the nominal value. Typically, a 0.15 mfd cap may have something more like 0.2 mfd actual capacitance.  For some reason, capacitance of both electrolytic and oil capacitors tends to be higher than the value stamped on the case.  Be sure to measure it with a capacitance meter or bridge, or else be prepared to use trial and error if you have several suitable capacitors on hand to substitute.

The size of that choke @ 600 MA is way more than what you need for a screen supply filter at amateur radio power levels.  That is more like what you would use in the main plate supply.
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Don, K4KYV                                       AMI#5
Licensed since 1959 and not happy to be back on AM...    Never got off AM in the first place.

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This message was typed using the DVORAK keyboard layout.
http://www.mwbrooks.com/dvorak
scottdarling1221
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« Reply #8 on: March 15, 2010, 06:20:32 PM »

Thank you for all of the info i really apreciate it.

I forgot to mention that the screen and plate supply are switched on and off everytime i key the amplifier.

The screen oil filled cap im using right now is .15 i think but i know its  2500 volts max working volts dc.And its been in there for years without a problem.

With the bleeders i have 2kv dc so i have 500 volts of a saftey margin.

Should i really change the cap to a 5kv cap do i need .15 uf or can i get away with more capacitence.

This whole resonant choke thing is new to me im trying to do it once and forget it.
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scottdarling1221
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« Reply #9 on: March 16, 2010, 07:23:45 PM »

I already have the choke and its nice and small so i figured why not use it.I was thinking about oil filled plastic cap in capacitors for the resonating cap.

Is there a special value i need for the c filter.
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