Are USA Hams the Most Courteous in the Whirl?

[K1JJ]

I was listening to a group of foreign hams tonight on 3795 from the UK and Norway talking about the, "sad state of affairs" in ham radio.

They had a European point of view and sounded to be in their 60's and 70's.  This is obviously a small sample. One said that ham radio behavior has gotten extremely bad and vulgar in Europe over the last year. They said some European on-air groups have gotten very political and racial over there on 160M and 75M. He said the Italians were by far the most aggressive, followed by the Germans.

They mentioned when working a DX pileup there's often lots of yelling back and forth by kilocycle cops from the various competing Euro countries.  I hear it myself when Huz and I hold court sometimes on 75M.  O'well. 

One went on to say that the USA hams were the most courteous and had the best behavior in the world -  and said it was probably because a ham license is still hard to get over here....    He said it's gotten too easy in Europe.  (I always thought the Japanese were very courteous hams too)

Up until today I wondered --- Why is it the social mood in America (and the whirl) has turned so negative, but has not yet spilled into ham radio??   Evidently it has in Europe.  I still hear very little friction on the bands in North America. (Canadians included)   North America,  give yourselves a pat on the back!

Any thoughts on this?

T


A free hug from a stranger at NearFest / HossTraders....

[W3RSW]

Depends on who you want to 'whirl.' 

.. and I like your dawg too.

See ya at the fester OM.  Near fest is Baltimore?  Far fest was Gathersburg?
  I'm on the other side of the mountains so no wonder I'm backwards.

[WB2YGF]

IMHO, despite their self-opinion that they are more "refined" and "enlightened" than the "crude" Americans, Europeans are having a much harder time accepting immigration and multiculturalism, especially with the EU open borders.  Now that everyone is competing for a decreasing number of jobs, there is a pushback, and bigotry is on the rise.

The French are amazing.  The government is not allowed to recognize race, therefore, racial inequality can't be documented and addressed.  Problem solved.

[K6JEK]

For awhile I had a pipeline to Japan.  It was just an EDZ pointed just right.  The Japanese hams were unfailingly polite and friendly.  Some also sent QSL cards that were things of beauty.

[k4kyv]

The French are amazing.  The government is not allowed to recognize race, therefore, racial inequality can't be documented and addressed.  Problem solved.

I lived in France for a while back in the early 70's.  There were a large number of North Africans who had immigrated to France and who enjoyed legal status, as a remnant of Algeria's former status of being ruled by France as a colony, and of Morocco of being a former French protectorate.  Resentment and prejudice against N. Africans was openly displayed by many members of the public.

Some of these same people held a stereotype that "You are American, therefore you are racist".  When reminded of the attitudes displayed in France against the Algerians, their standard response would be "but in America they (meaning black people) are "in their home country".

[Ed-VA3ES]

Huh?       Don, you just can't win against Cartesian logic, eh?   

Some of these same people held a stereotype that "You are American, therefore you are racist".  When reminded of the attitudes displayed in France against the Algerians, their standard response would be "but in America they (meaning black people) are "in their home country".

[Ed-VA3ES]

I know for  a fact that Canadian hams are the most courteous.       We are soooo courteous, that we will back off in an argument. In fact,  we are so courteous (liberal), that we will often take our opponent's side in an argument.   So there! 

[W1EUJ]

On South Park, they had this joke about two Canadians fighting:

"You're not my buddy, pal!"
"You're not my pal, friend!"
"You're not my friend, guy!"
"You're not my guy, buddy!"

[W3RSW]

....and all of good Scots-Irish descent,
   'cept for the "Quebecians."
Now there's a real dichotomy.
   "The tale of two cultures."

[Todd, KA1KAQ]

That's "K-bek-quaz", Rick. If you're ever around W1RC, as him for a demo. He grew up in Montreal and had to 'adapt'. Just be sure to wear a spit shield, that version of french apparently requires a lot of saliva. 

"You Canadian are, no?"

I suspect every country gets pigeon-holed to some extent by some geographic area, like Montreal, NYC, San Francisco, etc. The vast majority of hams whirlwide seem to be friendly and cordial, with the rude 'buy a corntest' stations in the loud minority. Listening to Tom, Steve, and Bob and Buddly having fun on the band shows what IMO ham radio is all about. No coat or tie required, pipe optional.

[Steve - WB3HUZ]

Not to mention how they cooperated with the Nazis in exterminating the Jews during WWII. Then there are the laws that require a certain amount of French songs be played on radio stations and French movies shown in movies theaters. Racism is EVERWHERE. Any country or group claiming to not be racist is by definition racist - they believe themselved to be better or superior to everyone else.

That said, there are courteous hams everywhere too. I think most put on their best face when working DX. The squabbles more oftern occur in within countries, continenents or regions.

The French are amazing.  The government is not allowed to recognize race, therefore, racial inequality can't be documented and addressed.  Problem solved.

I lived in France for a while back in the early 70's.  There were a large number of North Africans who had immigrated to France and who enjoyed legal status, as a remnant of Algeria's former status of being ruled by France as a colony, and of Morocco of being a former French protectorate.  Resentment and prejudice against N. Africans was openly displayed by many members of the public.

Some of these same people held a stereotype that "You are American, therefore you are racist".  When reminded of the attitudes displayed in France against the Algerians, their standard response would be "but in America they (meaning black people) are "in their home country".

[K1JJ]

That said, there are courteous hams everywhere too. I think most put on their best face when working DX. The squabbles more oftern occur in within countries, continenents or regions.

Good points.

I do find most hams are on their best behavior when working DX.  We really become diplomats for our countries, in a way.

Yes, there's courteous hams everywhere.

I find interesting listening when hearing the local European groups way down the band - when they are rag chewing amongst themselves like we do here.  Sometimes I turn on the bedside RX at 3AM with the 75M Quads headed NE and listen to the pissweak local Euro groups talking freely. It's daylight there and they would never believe anyone is hearing them beyond the country limits.  That's when I hear some of the best stuff...
The funniest stuff usually comes from the salty Irish and UK stations when they hang loose.

Ed: Yes, the Canadians have always been super friendly down in the DX window. I have a few good friends there from VE and we trade antenna info, etc.  Those guys build everything super strong with steel and heavy walled aluminum and well done. Noel, VE2HQ and Fern,VE2ZV come to mind.  Fern made two, ROTARY 2el quads for 75M and they both got hung up in the guy wires putting them up - and got ruined...


Here's some trivia shots of good times gone by:

T

[k4kyv]

Not to mention how they cooperated with the Nazis in exterminating the Jews during WWII. Then there are the laws that require a certain amount of French songs be played on radio stations and French movies shown in movies theaters

There were Nazi collaborators in the US during the war, too.  And more than once I have heard older Americans of that era speak supportively, or at least make excuses for, of the extermination of the Jews. Don't forget  the French Resistance that heroically fought a guerilla war against the Nazis during the occupation.

There are laws in Canada that require a certain amount of Canadian content in the songs played on the radio there, too.

Here in the US, we call it "affirmative action".

[Steve - WB3HUZ]

Right on. It's everywhere. Those who cry it's not here are surely the racists.

Not to mention how they cooperated with the Nazis in exterminating the Jews during WWII. Then there are the laws that require a certain amount of French songs be played on radio stations and French movies shown in movies theaters

There were Nazi collaborators in the US during the war, too.  And more than once I have heard older Americans of that era speak supportively, or at least make excuses for, of the extermination of the Jews. Don't forget  the French Resistance that heroically fought a guerilla war against the Nazis during the occupation.

There are laws in Canada that require a certain amount of Canadian content in the songs played on the radio there, too.

Here in the US, we call it "affirmative action".

[W1IA]

I was listening to a group of foreign hams tonight on 3795 from the UK and Norway talking about the, "sad state of affairs" in ham radio.

They had a European point of view and sounded to be in their 60's and 70's.  This is obviously a small sample. One said that ham radio behavior has gotten extremely bad and vulgar in Europe over the last year. They said some European on-air groups have gotten very political and racial over there on 160M and 75M. He said the Italians were by far the most aggressive, followed by the Germans.

They mentioned when working a DX pileup there's often lots of yelling back and forth by kilocycle cops from the various competing Euro countries.  I hear it myself when Huz and I hold court sometimes on 75M.  O'well. 

One went on to say that the USA hams were the most courteous and had the best behavior in the world -  and said it was probably because a ham license is still hard to get over here....    He said it's gotten too easy in Europe.  (I always thought the Japanese were very courteous hams too)

Up until today I wondered --- Why is it the social mood in America (and the whirl) has turned so negative, but has not yet spilled into ham radio??   Evidently it has in Europe.  I still hear very little friction on the bands in North America. (Canadians included)   North America,  give yourselves a pat on the back!

Any thoughts on this?

T


A free hug from a stranger at NearFest / HossTraders....

Apparently you haven't tuned into the "Keith an Brent show" Thats right, the radical republican hour designed to stir the dust and bring out all the piss weak liberal jammers.
(No not really) HA!

Still got myself buried in study for my CCO exams this coming week. Arrgh!
If I read one more OSHA, ANSI, ASME, PSCA regulation I'm going to puke!

The Tina!

p.s. see ya in the getho Juicy Jewels

[WB2YGF]

The French are amazing.  The government is not allowed to recognize race, therefore, racial inequality can't be documented and addressed.  Problem solved.

Are the French finally waking up?

France to consider ethnic census 

France is for the first time launching a commission to investigate ways of measuring the country's ethnic make-up.

The commission is being set up by President Nicolas Sarkozy's adviser on tackling discrimination, Yazid Sabeg.

Mr Sabeg said it was "essential to measure how effective are official policies combating discrimination".

But opponents say his idea breaches the French principle of equality for all. Classifying people by race or religious beliefs is currently illegal in France.

Mr Sabeg, a businessman of Algerian descent, argued that the country's egalitarian principle might be fine in theory, but in fact had done nothing to stop the growth of racial discrimination.

"It's no longer possible to say that here we say we're just one community and therefore there's no racism or discrimination. This isn't working any more," he told France Inter radio on Monday.

Taboo broached

The BBC's Hugh Schofield in Paris says that for many French, the very notion of ethnic statistics brings back dark memories of World War II, when the principle of equality was discarded in order to draw up lists of Jews for the occupying Nazis....

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7959715.stm
 

[WC1X]

Tom Vu,

I think  it's mostly band dependant and a matter of propagation.

Having lived on the other side of the pond seven years out of the last ten I draw the following conclusion:

The bad behavior that they talk about on the lower bands in Europe is about
the same level as I hear when I'm living in the states, the Europeans do not
hear this  when listening to the lower bands 'cuz most of these bad U.S. operators have a piss weak or non existent signal in Europe so they incorrectly assume it's not prevalent in the U.S.

On the higher bands, (20M>) most operators, both U.S. and European, exhibit better operating "civility". 

Overall though I feel that the US ham does have better on air civility than
our DX counterparts albeit by a small margin.

This is my two cents worth and is only one man's opinion!

Marc,  WC1X, M0VOA, 4Z8BB

[k9qs]

I am currently in South Korea, and will be returning in August. I have had a good ear on hams in Japan, and agree that they are extremely polite operators. It's probably required by law there, but they actually sign "portable," "mobile," and "/" in CW. IMHO, I kind of miss that requirement in the USA. I listen to JA the most often on 40 and 20m.

I do miss my canoe anchors though.

[WU2D]

I worked a German DL1EV on my Paraset the first weekend I had it operational. This was my first QSO with the little spy set. This was on 3520 kc and we held the frequency for 20 minutes. Anyway I got a nice QSL card and Bruno said that he had heard of the Paraset. I sent back my card and a nice letter with pictures of the set. I mentioned that I had been to Germany 4 times for work and that my youngest son is going over for a German language class trip for 3 weeks on an exchange. Last week I got a letter back explaining how he had been a young ham just before the war and he was in his late 80's now. He also sent my son Casey some  tashengeld  " Pocket Change" a money order for 40 Euros!