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Author Topic: History Channel  (Read 11626 times)
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W9ZSL
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« on: April 19, 2015, 04:23:53 PM »

I've been watching a series covering events leading up to WW2.  Of course, actors are playing the parts of all the leaders.  One scene set in 1934 shows Mussolini addressing the people prior to the invasion of Ethiopia.  On the podium in front of him were three Astatic D-104 mics on stands complete with the push-to-talk bars.  Oops! Hi, Hi, Hi!
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KA0HCP
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« Reply #1 on: April 19, 2015, 04:25:40 PM »

Did they have Chicken Choker Slides?   Smiley
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W9ZSL
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« Reply #2 on: April 19, 2015, 04:33:35 PM »

Probably because there didn't appear to be a gap between the bar and the stand.  Of course, the pix wasn't a close-up but there was no mistaking the mic.  In fact, they weren't completely matched because one base looked a bit darker than the other two.  The series is still airing right now.
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pa0ast
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« Reply #3 on: April 19, 2015, 05:13:07 PM »

The D-104 is from 1933 see   http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astatic_Corporation ,  so in italy in  1934 is possible.
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W9ZSL
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« Reply #4 on: April 19, 2015, 05:39:11 PM »

Really?  How about that!  I was under the impression that most mics of that era were carbons or perhaps ribbons not crystals.  

However, it's rather doubtful that Italians would be using D-104's in 1934 under any circumstances considering at that time Nationalism was rampant and the Astatic mics were not being produced 'en mass'.  I can't imagine Mussolini not using Italian mics.  My point is rather than the History Channel trying to be accurate, they used props which weren't accurate given the place and time of 1934.  The mics shown were definitely post WW2.
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Steve - K4HX
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« Reply #5 on: April 19, 2015, 07:20:59 PM »

The condenser mic was invented in 1916 and Western Electric condenser mice were in wide use by the 20s. Neumann was making condenser mic by at least the later 20s. You will see some of these in al Nazi films.

Dynamic mics were also around in the 20s and 30s. RCA had the ribbon mic in the early 30s.
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Jim, W5JO
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« Reply #6 on: April 19, 2015, 07:39:31 PM »

Was that the picture where all the mics were turned so that the screens were forward and the backs to him?  
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W3RSW
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« Reply #7 on: April 20, 2015, 09:59:57 AM »

Just watched the same thing last night and the same d104 s were used in front of Roosevelt's speech.  Turned around correctly.  At least they tried to put period pieces for the radio stuff.  Not so much for the Nazi Blitz of England B-17 bomber squadrons in massive block formation,  the bubble cockpit canopies of p51's for early war Me109s, the exceedingly modern rifles, tanks, landing craft, etc, for WWII battle scenes.  The modern Spruance class bow scene for a WWII Japanese battle ship heading to Pearl. At least they didn't show F15's being launched from the Reagan.

But most people don't know the diff between Hinkles and Boings, so all and all it was a good series with fine explanation of salient points of how WW's I and II, Spanish revolution, etc. were really one big long war.

The actors were quite good and didn't have superfluous speaking parts, Truman for example looked mostly contemplative as the narrator explained the events. I really thought Churchill was the best.

The Hitler representation and history was the best I've seen since early chapters of " The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich."

Tune in if its still on. Good show.
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W9ZSL
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« Reply #8 on: April 20, 2015, 12:53:14 PM »

There were also segments that showed the careers of all the principles going back to WW1.  One little tidbit was the reason Hitler had such an odd mustache is it was so bushy that his gas mask didn't seal properly so he cut it shorter and left it that way.  As for the props, they did the best they could.  I know from actual news clips of the time that one of the mics of choice for Roosevelt was the Western Electric or Altec 639 "bird cage" type.
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flintstone mop
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« Reply #9 on: April 20, 2015, 08:22:06 PM »

Hitler had some weird looking mics in front of him at the podium. What was the purpose of a row of these mics? Usually 4 or 5 in a row?? Feedback prevention? More power to the people??
Fred
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Fred KC4MOP
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Rick & "Roosevelt"


« Reply #10 on: April 20, 2015, 09:33:32 PM »

In those days every major network and local affiliates would place their own mike in front of important speakers for any event that could be pre-wired.  Few common Feeds or sharing going on. Wouldn't surprise me if a telegrapher or two weren't transcribing and sending reports in a back room at same time.  And then there were the 'pencils' scattered around the sides and back walls. Big rush to the phones, local western Union office, local newspapers and radio stations that didn't get there soon enough to wire up.  Everyone running down the street with any major announcement.

In Hitler's case, half the mikes went to the hall or stadium PA system, record cutters or possibly wire recorders for the 1000 year Reich's History archives.  Shocked. Twelve's all he got.

Some sages even gauged the importance of an event or the vanity of the speaker by the number of mikes arrayed. ..kind of like two alarm vs. five alarm fires.

Kind of Surprised you asked.  

So along with the other biggies you had Mutual Broadcasting that wasn't so mutual.  Grin
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RICK  *W3RSW*
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« Reply #11 on: April 21, 2015, 08:18:56 AM »

Well, I suppose that nearly 80 years on we must forgive TV producers the practicalities of coming up with period looking props.  Most depictions of Roman soldiers have ridiculous interpretations of armor and accessories despite excellent documentation in the form of statues, mosaics, drawings and museum pieces.
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W7NGA
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« Reply #12 on: April 21, 2015, 10:55:59 AM »

> Most depictions of Roman soldiers have ridiculous interpretations of armor and accessories

not to mention some are wearing wrist-watches  Cheesy

dan W7NGA
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KB2WIG
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« Reply #13 on: April 21, 2015, 11:07:47 AM »



Must be XIpods.

klc
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W9ZSL
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« Reply #14 on: April 21, 2015, 01:29:27 PM »

I think Hitler used early Condenser types.  Maybe he needed a few back-ups in case of failure?  I know the Germans had radio networks so maybe multiple feeds were required to individual stations in "dead zones."  Then there was the film crew along with disk recordings early and tape recordings later.  Maybe a "safety" duplicate recording or two was made simultaneously.  I wonder if anyone has written a book about the subject?
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pa0ast
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« Reply #15 on: April 21, 2015, 02:45:47 PM »

The tape recorder was already in use years before  ww2 in Germany, invented by AEG . With hf bias current and 6mm tape with iron oxide.. good place to look is at     http://www.cdvandt.org/exhibits_new.htm   they ( the germans) had even a spoken letter service from the front on tape to the postoffice at home for people who could not write or read..
Realy incredible and very interesting  what in this museum  is to see and read about ww2 german war stuf.
The last receiver they added to the collection is a receiver made by Lorenz for the Richt Funk  Emiel set. Normally it was supplied with a telefunken one . It was a gift for the museum from Brian  Harrison KN4R.


* Kl-Tonschreiber b-0.jpg (104.37 KB, 1824x1368 - viewed 368 times.)
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W3RSW
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Rick & "Roosevelt"


« Reply #16 on: April 21, 2015, 04:11:13 PM »

Very informative and interesting pa0,  Thanks for the info.

Here's some Wiki stuff about it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnetophon

And another neat site about sound recording from waxies, wire, tape and  onwards.

http://museumofmagneticsoundrecording.org/Education.html
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« Reply #17 on: April 21, 2015, 07:41:18 PM »

The tape recorder was one of the spoils of war the USA gained. Not long after the war, they were being used in professional recording and copies/adaptions were being produced.

As far as historically accurate items in movies, there is really no excuse now, what with 3D printing capabilities. Any physical object can be scanned and copies easily made.
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W9ZSL
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« Reply #18 on: April 22, 2015, 12:19:55 PM »

Ampex was one of the first companies to build recorders in this country.  They were establised in 1944 building motors and generators for the armed forces.  By 1948 they began manufacturing recorders after seeing demonstrations of the German Magnetophon.  Bing Crosby bought the first two so he could record his first show for the East Coast live and then play the recording later for the West Coast rather than do two shows. The network wasn't very happy about it.

Then along came Les Paul, a close friend of Crosby, whose trio backed Bing on his 1945 hit "It's Been A Long, Long Time", who had Ampex build the first 8-Track 1" machine in the early 50's.  The biggest problem was with the tape formulation.  It didn't take long for friction at high speed to wear out and it was so rough that it acted like sand paper on the heads.  That's why Ampex developed tape early-on and made sure it and the machines were happy with each other.  BASF in Germany also had developed tape for the Magnetophone and 50 reels were included along with machines in those "spoils of war." 

Magnecord developed a smaller unit for broadcast, the PT-6 in 1948.  We had a couple of those at the station where I worked and we still used them into the late 60's.
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WD8BIL
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« Reply #19 on: April 22, 2015, 02:40:03 PM »

In Germany at that time the D104 was prized among the youth!!

http://www.medamilitaria.com/pesonalized-hitler-youth-knife---d104.html
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« Reply #20 on: April 22, 2015, 02:42:07 PM »

Jim Morrison would have certainly turned Dolph on to some better microphones when they were in South America together in the 70s.
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W9ZSL
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« Reply #21 on: April 23, 2015, 12:12:06 PM »

Which end of that D-104 did you talk into?
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K1JJ
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« Reply #22 on: April 23, 2015, 12:59:29 PM »

The AHC (American Heros Channel)  and History Channel WWI and WWII shows, Gold Rush, the Street Outlaws drag racing, the Gas Monkey car fix up shows, Pawn Stars, Survival shows, How Do They Make It shows, etc., are the most interesting stuff on TV.  

That said, I still flip channels to avoid the commercials. I think I've set some kind of record -  I once flipped to ten different channels in a row and they were all in commercial. Unbelievable.   And we pay top dollar for the service to begin with.

T
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« Reply #23 on: April 24, 2015, 11:59:29 AM »

The networks and stations long before cable came to an agreement to air commercials at set times to prevent channel-surfing; reason being if you tried to find something different to watch during one network's commercial break, all you would find would be another commercial.  "Spot breaks" also allowed producers to divide the program up into segments which could then be timed out to fit their allotted slot.  Have you ever noticed that open and close theme songs had different-lengths?  "Golden Girls" is a great example.  Some times you would get a long version of the "Thank You For Being A Friend" and other times you heard a shorter version which acted as a pad or filler depending on how the program timed out.
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« Reply #24 on: April 25, 2015, 12:51:56 AM »

No commercials on Netflix and effectively none with Tivo.
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