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Author Topic: NC183D color and other information  (Read 36956 times)
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N7CTF
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« Reply #50 on: January 09, 2012, 02:22:12 PM »

 Smiley
Hi guys, 

I'm new to this fine forum and I found it searching for info on my "new" Nat NC-183D.  Love it!

A few days ago I found a listing for all the color mixing scheems used on the various Shortwave receivers.  I looked all morning and can't find it now.. but when I do I'll post it here.  I'm telling you this cuz you may be able to find it too..  I was looking for modifications for my 183.  (which I haven't been able to find??)

When painting the case, I've seen one guy on Uteby put a special "masking" or tape over the knob labels.  Then he painted it and pulled off the masking.  It left little rectangles and squares were the masking was and where the labels were the background was a different color.

I have to paint my case as I've got a few scratches and dings and I need to find out just how to do this.  I'm thinking that if I just paint over the labeling and later go back with a sharp tool or something, I can scrape some of the paint I sprayed into the labels and then refill the letters with white model paint (Testors model paint)...

What do you guys ('n' gals) do for this job? Grin

Scotty
N7CTF
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ke7trp
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« Reply #51 on: January 09, 2012, 03:59:48 PM »

If the panel is engraved you can repaint this your self easily.  Sand down the chassis using a buzz sander.  Then use a primer coat and sand again by hand Once its perfectly smooth, Repaint the chassis.  

For the lettering,  Get some water based white paint from a crafts store. They sell this paint in small plastic bottles very cheap.  Also get a small foam small brush while you are there.

Paint the engraving with the goal of filling the engraving with paint. Then take a piece of printer paper and tear off  a 2 inch wide strip.  Wipe across the lettering to remove the excess paint.  You will be left with perfect white lettering, like the factory had.  It also helps to have a damp cloth handy to clean up the excess paint as it dries. Its water based paint so you have nothing to worry about and this cant really go wrong. I used this on my R390 panel and filled the panel lettering back in using this meathod. It came out perfect.


C


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ke7trp
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« Reply #52 on: January 09, 2012, 04:00:33 PM »

more


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N7CTF
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« Reply #53 on: January 09, 2012, 09:00:59 PM »

 Wink

Sounds good!..  Just go for it and don't worry about the writing.  Then fill it and wipe.

Thanks.

Now if I can only find that paint color file not that it matters a lot because I'm going to paint the whole case inside and out.

Now.. I just need to figure out which mods are more important than others.. One place I read the guy was talking about "flattening" out the Audio section.. That's a good idea.  It would be nice to be able to bring up the bass area too.

Another stated that the sensitivity is less on the higher frequencies.  That would be a good thing to fix too.

I don't think I need anything to enhance SSB sigs.  Nor do I need an FM detector. 

I'm still waiting for some tubes..  caps.. and I noticed already that many of those resistors are NOT the value marked.  This might take a while!   Cry
Scotty
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ke7trp
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« Reply #54 on: January 09, 2012, 09:10:56 PM »

Have the paint matched at car paint supplier.  Thats what I would do.

All the caps are bad and will have to be replaced.  Work at one tube at a time. All caps, All resistors need to be checked and replaced.  Its sad, But the resistors are likely all bad.

C
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N7CTF
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« Reply #55 on: January 09, 2012, 09:16:43 PM »

 Cry

Sniff Sniff...  OK..  Cry

I guess that's why I do this.  Started with little ALLAmerican 5  radios.. The hit my old Heathkit GR54!.. Then on to my Heath Sb102!  Now.. Boatanchors!..

Me Happy! Grin
Scotty
N7CTF Roll Eyes

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w3jn
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« Reply #56 on: January 09, 2012, 10:49:51 PM »

I strongly disagree - ALL caps will NOT be bad.  The filters and bypasses, perhaps, but they'll need replacing anyway.  You might find an odd silver mica that's bad but those generally hold up fairly well.  In any event do NOT go nuts replacing the low value micas without verifying they are bad.

Although National used crap resistors I seldom find one that needs more than a few replaced.  Check every resistor, though, because they do have a habit of changing value or, in the case of 220K resistors all measuring 22K (or vice versa, can't remember) perhaps National got some mislabled resistors from the factory.

An easier method of panel lettering is to use a lacquer stick.  It's a "pen" that goes on as kind of a thick paste and collects in the engravings but doesn't stick too well to the panel.   I've tried every paint method known to man to fill engraving and the lacquer stick method works by far the best.

Finally, if you don't want to go to the expense of having custom paint mixed, there's a Duplicolor charcoal for GM trucks that's VERY close to the original color.  You can only tell side-by side; however, it has a bit more metallic in than I'd like.  Good primer and plenty of sanding in between coats, taking care to clean the cabinet well between each coat, will give you an outstanding looking radio.
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N7CTF
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« Reply #57 on: January 10, 2012, 09:40:58 AM »

 Smiley

Sounds like a good idea, I'll see if I can find one of those pens or lacquer sticks.  I've got a white grease pencil.  I don't think that would be very permanent though.
I'll be checking things as I go anyway.  the only ones I just pull out are the Ecaps.  Then I'll fire it up and see what I've got before continuing.
I told my Wife that I was going to repaint it and she thought it was a bad idea.. She said " this case has character!  Shows a bit of the life it lived for 40+ years" ! ..  And she's kinda right.  It's not that bad, a couple scratches here and there and little fingernail scratches around some of the controls and knobs.  The usual wear you'd expect.  A couple spots of rust on the chassis.  All in all a clean machine after I used my Windex and Simple Green cleaners on the case and chassis. 

Scotty
N7CTFJust had to try that marque thing.  Grin
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KM1H
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« Reply #58 on: January 10, 2012, 12:13:37 PM »

I bet that 10-15 resistors will be well out of tolerance and I wouldnt worry about ceramic or mica caps unless you have a problem that points to one.

Tighten all ground connections and dont overlook that bare ground wire that connects all the antenna coils together; there is often a bad solder joint at the ground lug.

Carl
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Jim, W5JO
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« Reply #59 on: January 10, 2012, 02:18:56 PM »

Do be sure to check the IF stages screen resistors.  I have seen several of these radios with bad screen by pass caps in the IF section as well.  They run hot so the screen resistors tend to drift. 
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ke7trp
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« Reply #60 on: January 10, 2012, 10:21:59 PM »

Yeah. That was kinda stupid using "ALL".  In my mind I was thinking ALL paper bypass caps. 

The resistor count will be high but it depends on what you consider out of tolerance.. 10%, 20, 50?   

Just check them to be sure.

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w3jn
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« Reply #61 on: January 11, 2012, 12:19:46 AM »

Agree 100%, Clark.  Also the panel lettering method you described works very well for radios with deep engraving like the R-390.  Not so well with shallow and thin engraving (which appears to be actually stamped, not engraved), like National products.  Believe me, I've tried everything.  Even with the lacquer stick you might end up not being able to get good results on very thin areas... I have a NC-173 that has some really shallow lettering that I can't get entirely filled no matter what I try.
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W7TFO
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« Reply #62 on: January 11, 2012, 01:22:29 AM »

I have a NC-173 that has some really shallow lettering that I can't get entirely filled no matter what I try.

I have had success with a properly-sized Rapidiograph pen & white ink.  They ain't cheap, but you will have it forever if you take care of it.  It is a drafting instrument used for lettering by Koh-I-Noor.

It flows liquid ink into the groove very nicely, and you don't need to do any 'wiping'.  If your hand is good enough, you can letter panels with it in any color ink you can get.

73DG
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« Reply #63 on: January 11, 2012, 09:45:35 AM »

For the engraved lettering, I have used white china markers.   They are like a white wax crayon, maybe a little harder.    Rub over the lettering until it is filled, then use a cotton cloth the rest off.
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N7CTF
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« Reply #64 on: January 11, 2012, 12:00:52 PM »

 Smiley
Yes, "white wax crayon" where the white is exposed by unwrapping a continuous paper?  that's the "grease" pencil I was referring to.

Thanks guys. 
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KM1H
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« Reply #65 on: January 11, 2012, 12:24:09 PM »

The white crayon and unwinding the paper is the way National did it but for some reason I remember it as white lead??

The cabinets, including the Service Dept. overhauls, were a baked finish and we applied when they were still a bit warm and then just removed excess with alcohol on a rag.


Carl
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ke7trp
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« Reply #66 on: January 11, 2012, 12:27:21 PM »

On the last few cabinets I did, I baked them in an oven. This really smooths out the finish and makes it durable.

 

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N7CTF
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« Reply #67 on: January 11, 2012, 04:00:32 PM »

 Grin

Do ya gotta stick a fork in 'em when there done?

 Shocked Shocked Shocked Shocked Shocked Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
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ke7trp
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« Reply #68 on: January 15, 2012, 01:30:55 AM »

I got my second and near mint NC183D recapped today.  I started in the morning and tested each cap and replaced them with PS series orange Drops. PS is 10% rating instead of 5%. 

I found all of the .1 bypass caps reading .15 to .18.   All of the new PS orange drops read .1 to .12. 

I found ONE .05 Sangamo (pink) in color that read .18.  I replaced it with the others. The Electrolytics where leaky.  I replaced them.  The 10UF at near the audio read 22 UF.  I replaced it with a 22 as that is what I had on hand. 

This did not take nearly as long as I thought.  I guess its because I just recapped the orignal 183D in this thread. I got a nice power cord out of a junk bin and wired it in to replace the old 2 prong cord. 

The radio is up and running and all functions work.  The Dials are spot on and the Rig is sensitive. The only issue is that the rig sounds muddy when tuned dead on a station.  I am going to do the IF alignment in the next couple days. I hope this clears up.  If I tune just off center of max s meter, the radio sounds very hi fi and clear.  But max s mter reading and all the highs go out. 

I have not tested the resistors, I ran out of time and energy.  I will do that in the next few days and button this rig up.  I am very pleased with it!


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N7CTF
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« Reply #69 on: January 16, 2012, 09:57:28 AM »

 Grin Grin Grin

Nice KE7TRP!  Real Nice.  Wow, on Efray, they sure are getting high prices for those nice Nat. speakers!  I'm using an old Stereo 8 ohm speaker.  Great Bass and crossover inside helps the highs.

I'm going to have to spend some time on Mouser and Digikey etc to see what I need.  I haven't seen PS orange Drops.  I may just order from my ol' place in Da North! 

Looking at some of my paper caps in my 183d.  The cap is labeled .047  and the drawing says it should be a .05 (C79 area).  The factory stock must have run out of the .05's and brought in a box of .047's..  Sure.. it's close enough for government work. Shocked Shocked Shocked


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KM1H
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« Reply #70 on: January 17, 2012, 01:54:00 PM »

It seems that a whole bunch of National stuff that was reasonably priced has taken sudden leaps up in the past year or so. There are many new guys getting into BA's and find many models are no longer in their budget. The HRO-60 has gone thru the roof and they are far from scarce having been in production for 16 years.

The NC-200 and NC-240D are still sleepers that are good performers (PP 6V6 audio and great looks) especially with a 455kHz ceramic fiter kit added.
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W7TFO
WTF-OVER in 7 land Dennis
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« Reply #71 on: January 17, 2012, 02:22:49 PM »

Nobody has mentioned this source, but I buy a lot of caps from euro dealers on eBay selling Russian military surplus.  Smokin' prices, too.

Great caps, be them poly, paper-in-oil, mica, eTc.  Real retro-style like Sprague and CDE, but made recently and not one out of the hundreds I've bought has been bad.

Two guys I deal with and never had a problem are kwtubes and hmlhml.

73DG
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ke7trp
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« Reply #72 on: January 17, 2012, 03:42:43 PM »

It seems that a whole bunch of National stuff that was reasonably priced has taken sudden leaps up in the past year or so. There are many new guys getting into BA's and find many models are no longer in their budget. The HRO-60 has gone thru the roof and they are far from scarce having been in production for 16 years.

The NC-200 and NC-240D are still sleepers that are good performers (PP 6V6 audio and great looks) especially with a 455kHz ceramic fiter kit added.

There are alot of new hams.  I think also a sad but try thing is that a generation of hams are releasing the gear, either as they SK or get ill.  Alot of my gear has come this way Carl.  Sad but true.

C
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Jim, W5JO
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« Reply #73 on: January 17, 2012, 05:34:04 PM »

There are alot of new hams.  I think also a sad but try thing is that a generation of hams are releasing the gear, either as they SK or get ill.  Alot of my gear has come this way Carl.  Sad but true.

I sold three transmitters and receivers two years ago because of my age and the light at the end of the tunnel is getting bigger.  Also, because of lack of space in a new house that is much smaller because we are getting older.  I still like em though and, in a pinch, would work on one for fun but not keep it.

My wife would have enough to do if something happens.
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ke7trp
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« Reply #74 on: January 21, 2012, 06:33:37 PM »

The first NC183D went to its new home today.  Its going to replace a hammy HQ160.  I think he will be pleased.  That NC183D had lots of sensitivity and really performed.

The second NC183D is complete as of today.  All the paper and molded caps have been replaced by PS series orange Drops. PS are 10% rating instead of 5% of the typical caps. Everything went smoothly and the rig is playing nicely.  Here is a short videa of it playing some BC station music.  This video also stars Toby the Golden retriever.

Thanks to all that helped me with these two Boat anchors.

C

http://youtu.be/pysFyA43hAA
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