New Car Sales - 2008 To 2009 - Sliding Over The Edge

[ka3zlr]

I was looking at the New Challenger, I had a 1970 once upon a time and just really miss the ride of that Cage, anyhow after looking at the MSRP and out the door cost i guess I'll be looking for another used one in up an coming days..LOL

73
Jack.

[W3SLK]

Bruce said:

...Timing belt service is not until 105K miles.
....

Yeah about 5~10K miles after that, you can usually count on replacing the main seals since they are under a little more tension then they are accustomed to with the new timing belt.

[WA1GFZ]

2001 Silverado. 110K miles, Mobile 1 every 5K, 1 set of tires. 1 battery, 1 wheel bearing and 1 brake job. Let's see that was about $800 total not counting the oil. So that is $100 a year plus oil and a couple filters. Changed the air filter once but it was still clean.  OH yea, I did add a couple oz. of oil to the rear end once.
Exhaust solid. runs like new still gets around 20 MPG on a trip. used to get 21 before alki was added to gas NTBE bad stuff glad it is gone.

Those crappy American cars.....

[Opcom]

Oh yeah my 2004 silverado is horrible. In the 97000 miles I put on it so far I "had to" replace a light bulb behind a button in the radio and one behind a button on the steering wheel, and grease the steering column, and change the rear brake pads.

The maintenance comparison should be dollars per 100K miles, not necessarily per years.

I do not count, against reliability, the set of tires I wore out or the oil changes every 3Kmiles or the dealer-recommended service intervals for other things. Those are preventive maintenance consumables. The light bulbs really are as well.

Having to grease the steering colum and replace the rear brake pads after 97000 miles. what a horrible American car!

[Ed W1XAW]

My point was not whether certain cars were good or bad or whether or not people in good ole USA have the right to choose, but rather, if you are trying to stretch your transportation dollars, the most obvious place to start is the payment.  You're not going to get the best bang for your buck for the Swede and German cars no matter how long they last (that extra $300 a month payment would pay for a lot of repairs).   Also, I either change the oil myself or go to a quick change place, mostly going to a shop when something is truly broken that I think I would mess up (call that the crisis mode of maintenance, I call it thrift).   Of course I do make sure that the recommended maint. is covered during the warranty period but I'll be damned if I'm going to pay a fortune for somebody to check fluids and replace plugs cuz the book says so when its over.   Ed

[ka3zlr]

As I'm off with the last remnants of the latest flu flying around..YUK.. I have a question for all you maintenance calculators.. how do you guys feel and how much time is spent on undercoating...there's alot to be said about prohibitive maintaince...

To be honest i go back and have mine refreshed every year...I don't care it's worth it..

73
Jack.

[Steve - WB3HUZ]

TCO, that's the bottom line. You have it nailed.

My point was not whether certain cars were good or bad or whether or not people in good ole USA have the right to choose, but rather, if you are trying to stretch your transportation dollars, the most obvious place to start is the payment.  You're not going to get the best bang for your buck for the Swede and German cars no matter how long they last (that extra $300 a month payment would pay for a lot of repairs).   Also, I either change the oil myself or go to a quick change place, mostly going to a shop when something is truly broken that I think I would mess up (call that the crisis mode of maintenance, I call it thrift).   Of course I do make sure that the recommended maint. is covered during the warranty period but I'll be damned if I'm going to pay a fortune for somebody to check fluids and replace plugs cuz the book says so when its over.   Ed

[Steve - WB3HUZ]

On most newer cars it's a waste. But if you don't care, why ask?

As I'm off with the last remnants of the latest flu flying around..YUK.. I have a question for all you maintenance calculators.. how do you guys feel and how much is spent on undercoating...there's alot to be said about prohibitive maintaince...

To be honest i go back and have mine refreshed every year...I don't care it's worth it..

73
Jack.

[ka3zlr]

Well everybody is bitching about cost per paid maintenance mile here, It's not my idea I live in Pa. around here you will undercoat your vehicle if you want some lasting body effect..

Hi Steve..



73
Jack.

[Steve - WB3HUZ]

Yep. I grew up there. Lots of salt. If possible, high pressure washing the underside of your car often can pay big dividends. Water is cheaper than undercoating. 

One other factor to consider is how long you plan to keep the vehicle. The longer the time, the more "valuable" undercoating could become. However, you must consider the rest of the vehicle too. It doesn't do you much good if you have a rust free car with a crapped out motor/tranny, etc.

It's back to that TCO thing.

Well everybody is bitching about cost per paid maintenance mile here, It's not my idea I live in Pa. around here you will undercoat your vehicle if you want some lasting body effect..

Hi Steve..



73
Jack.

[W1UJR]

Right Steve, washing is really important in the areas which use road salt. I try to wash my car once a week in the winter, and always have it detailed and waxed before winter and right before summer. Here on the coast road salt is forbidden and we use "sand", but not the white beach sand, this is nasty brown stuff, it looks like mud on your car. It gets onto the rims and causes tire imbalance and shaking, messy stuff, but not as corrosive as NaCL, and better for the environment.

As for undercoating, I imagine that the same is true for domestics, most of the newer European cars don't need undercoating, the rubberized factory stuff far exceeds any garden variety spray on product. This rubberized material usually lasts the life of the car, and is notoriously difficult to remove. In my opinion, undercoating a car already in service, unless the area is surgically clean, is a bad idea as it usually traps any dirt and moisture, causing rust to form. Touching up damaged undercoating, with the right product, does need to be done from time to time. Generally when you see rust on these cars, other than than from in stone chips in the paint, it is a result of an poor quality collision repair, where the body shop did not properly apply new rustproofing.

There is a neat spray on oil product, called sold under a variety of trade names, "Rustop" is one example.
See -->> http://www.rustop.net/products/envirors100/
This is a very waxy oil, that seems to be effective on early cars, but needs to be renewed annually.
Despite the "Enviro" name, it seems to drive the greenies crazy, but I think this is a very good product, especially for early cars which lacked good factory rustproofing. Take at look at this if you have an older, classic car, or a very early car with the old asphalt undercoating.


In other news, I see that both Saab and Volvo are working with the Swedish government for a loan/line of credit.
Saab in particular looks like it might be bought back by the Swedes from GM.
Reuters has the story here -->> http://www.reuters.com/article/innovationNews/idUSTRE52B25920090312
And it looks like the ChiComs have wisely lost interest in Volvo, can't imagine the average Volvo owner driving a "Chinese car". http://money.cnn.com/news/newsfeeds/articles/djf500/200903050802DOWJONESDJONLINE000621_FORTUNE5.htm

And that's the way it is. 

[ka3zlr]

Yep. I grew up there. Lots of salt. If possible, high pressure washing the underside of your car often can pay big dividends. Water is cheaper than undercoating. 

One other factor to consider is how long you plan to keep the vehicle. The longer the time, the more "valuable" undercoating could become. However, you must consider the rest of the vehicle too. It doesn't do you much good if you have a rust free car with a crapped out motor/tranny, etc.

It's back to that TCO thing.

Well everybody is bitching about cost per paid maintenance mile here, It's not my idea I live in Pa. around here you will undercoat your vehicle if you want some lasting body effect..

Hi Steve..



73
Jack.

Agreed Steve,

 See that's my thing, always was, I keep my choice of vehicles for the Long run..All my trucks that I had, and I undercoat the devil out of them, of course the little side deals I've played with here an there used cars the girls banged up..no dice, they get tossed when they wore them out...maintenance was just oil, tires and consumables..Safety for the Girls..

But I'm just a big fan treating the exposed metal parts as I feel warranted, the underneath takes all the brunt..

[W1UJR]

Here's a novel idea to boost new car sales from the Germans!
You know the Germans, those friendly, innovative folks who brought you blood sausage, lederhosen, the Reinheitsgebot, and the Autobahn.

http://www.time.com/time/business/article/0,8599,1884711,00.html





Germany's Auto Woes Fix: Scrap That Clunker!
By ADAM SMITH / LONDON Thursday, Mar. 12, 2009
A sign announces the so-called Abwrackpraemie, or scrap-car-incentive, at a car dealership in Berlin, Germany.

Amid the gruesome headlines generated by the world's auto industry these days, it almost read like a typo: new car registrations in Germany rose 21% year-on-year in February, the country's Association of the Automotive Industry (VDA) announced March 3. This, though, was no error. The 278,000 cars put on the road, crowed Matthias Wissmann, VDA's president, amounted to "the highest level of sales in the month of February for ten years."

Why the splurge? German drivers have latched onto a juicy new deal. Under a scheme started in January, car owners who trade in a vehicle more than nine years old for a new, greener model can expect $3,172 from the German government as well as a break from paying road tax for at least a year. Similar "scrapping schemes" have been launched in recent months in France, Italy and Spain. Now motor manufacturers in Britain are pleading with its government to follow suit.

[W3SLK]

Bruce said:

You know the Germans, those friendly, innovative folks who brought you blood sausage, lederhosen, the Reinheitsgebot, and the Autobahn.

And don't forget Farfegnugen