3.892 a disaster and a disgrace

[ka2zni]

After listening to the guys on 3.892 last night I am now 100% converted to AM and could care less if I ever run SSB... I in my life never heard such nonsense as I did last night, thank goodness for AM'ers or these guys wouldn't have anything to talk about. They all got mad last night, had nothing better to do, and dropped down to 3.888, and intentionally started qrm'ing the guys trying to manage a QSO on 3.885, their definitely a poor example of the amateur community and it's a shame to see that grown men of their age, stature and time spent in the hobby only reduces them too mere children when they pick up the microphone.

They knew exactly what they were doing, talked openly about it on the air, I had finally had enough and even though i do not have an antenna up for 160 yet, went down there and listened for a while, the band was relatively quiet and the signals good. I cannot wait to get up my 160 meter 1/2 wave double bazooka so there are other places to go as well.

I thought there was a little more responsibility to the hobby and a few more ethics implemented, sure enough though, 3.892 seems to be populated with cb'ers that hold tickets. Quite a shame and an eye sore to the hobby. 

On a positive note it is great to see so many still carrying on the AM tradition and in a day and age of a throw away society, that so many are keeping the old rigs up and running, home brewing continues, that to me is the epitome of the hobby. 

[WA3VJB]

I can understand your reaction, but I hope you didn't give them the satisfaction of seeing that they had "gotten" you.

Next time, do a people search and call them on the phone.

You'd be surprised how shocked someone like that can be when you approach them off the air.

[W3SLK]

Or better yet, drop Riley a line with dates, times, & call signs. If possible, 'roll tape' and send it to him. But I think a heartfelt email from someone like yourself who is new to AM and shameful of his SSB roots might go a long way in prosecuting these Pinheads.

[ka2zni]

I can understand your reaction, but I hope you didn't give them the satisfaction of seeing that they had "gotten" you.

Next time, do a people search and call them on the phone.

You'd be surprised how shocked someone like that can be when you approach them off the air.

No I certainly didn't give them any fuel for the fire so to speak, and I like your idea of the phone calls...        Yeah I could definitely see where it would put them on the spot, Just a shame that by gentleman's agreement the AM community is crammed into a small spot to begin with, and than hammered on even further with the garbage that went on last night is ridiculous

Oh well... I am enjoying the AM segment and the people I have found here, the topics are interesting and the people great on here. Was on 40 meters the other day and got to talk with a bunch up in the northeast, WA1HLR and some of the others, think Tim was working on a BC310 that day...

Anyway, look forward to meeting more of you on the air. 

[WA3VJB]

Looking forward to meeting you too.

Actually, the FCC's decision to expand the 75 meter phone band has had good effects on AM activity that I should point out to you.

There is another gathering point around 3725Kc that the Canadian AM community had established years ago.  We just had to sit and be frustrated not being able to join them until the FCC"s move.

And so, depending on your license class, you may consider spooling down to the 3700 zone to look for some wholesome AM. The neighbors are a lot more friendly too.

[n3mir]

these guys that run sideband on the upper part of 75 have been
on for years and make cb'rs look like good operators


that's a shame on us all

dave

[ka2zni]

There is another gathering point around 3725Kc that the Canadian AM community had established years ago.  We just had to sit and be frustrated not being able to join them until the FCC"s move.

Thanks for that bit of info, I will have to upgrade a bit further to make that move but will enjoy the conversation down there and will have to listen in for the time being.

[ka2zni]

these guys that run sideband on the upper part of 75 have been
on for years and make cb'rs look like good operators


that's a shame on us all

dave

Couldn't agree with you more Dave, I have been licensed almost 30 years, and have seen the good and the bad, although admittedly I am still a newbie compared to some thats for sure.. but we all had to start somewhere, not to many of us were born with a soldering iron in one hand and a mic in the other! hi!! 

But yeah until comming to AM I shyed away from 75 meters because of the cliques/groups and stayed mostly on 40 meters... And plse don't get me wrong, there are alot of great guys on ssb as well as AM on all bands, but 75 meters does have it's fair share of lids on there...

I agree with WA3VJB ... I think the band expansion was a good decision and a great move on I think everyones part, Like I said we'll have to do some more upgrading and with the new sunspot activity soon too begin, it will breathe some life back into 40 meters again as well.

I remember seems to me back in the early too mid '90's when 75 meters was quite a bit worse as far as language/carrying on and so forth... I just wish with these "Gentleman" agreements that the lines drawn in the sand were a little more adherred to. It certainly would make it more enjoyable for anyone so it seems.

Anyway that's just my ".02" and in this day and wage isn't worth much! Hi Hi! 

[kb9edm]

Hello all. Came across your post here about the child-like behavior on 3892 kc. A number of us in the upper midwest use the frequency mornings and as soon as these old time lids hear a carrier they start up with their B.S. They mock the AM'ers and openly admit that they are running over the legal limits on their amplifiers just to be a real pain in the butt. And whining how it's "their frequency", and that they've been there for x amount of years and blah,blah,blah.The reason we use the frequency is to stay away from the QRM from 3885 kc and it's ashame that these idiots have to ruin a good thing. I'm a relative babe in the hobby,(almost 18 years), and only in the AM mode the last few years. The class of people I have met in this mode surpasses any I have heard in any other. Friendly,knowledgable,and willing to help their fellow hams out. The majority of the ham community are this way,but the small percentage of these a__holes do their part to drive potentional hams away from the hobby. For the most part the CB'ers have better behavior. I agree with "running tape" and documentation mentioned in earlier posts because trying to talk to these idiots would be like pissing in the wind. Anyways,enough of my rants. 73 all, Jerry/KB9EDM

[ka2zni]

The reason we use the frequency is to stay away from the QRM from 3885 kc and it's ashame that these idiots have to ruin a good thing. I'm a relative babe in the hobby,(almost 18 years), and only in the AM mode the last few years. The class of people I have met in this mode surpasses any I have heard in any other. Friendly,knowledgable,and willing to help their fellow hams out.

Couldn't agree more, that's what has attracted me to AM, amongst other things, and on a quiet day with audio comming out of a quality xmtr, man you just can't beat the sound whether it's class E or tube...

[The Slab Bacon]

Kevin,
           Welcome to the wonderful world of 75m!! This kinda crap goes on all of the time. It is not for the faint at heart!! But we have had a lot of fun on 3885 over the years. There have always been "interlopers" who have tried to qwerm us out of there and push us off into the ocean. You just learn to ignore them. Just quietly QRO, dont say a word about them and ignore them. Sooner or later they go away. Remember: "strap and ignore"

I came in on the tail end of that mess last night. Those idiots were pissing and moaning about the AMers, talking about physical retaliation, and the usual flapping of the gums that comes from the inbred knuckle draggers. This kind of crap has gone on for many years. I have actually heard many times that they want to push us off the band. I just ignore them.

I wasnt even going to fire up, but Don (KYV) came in with such a pounding signal that I fired up anyway, here comes Tom (ZGC), Mike (2ZE), Johnny (FXE) and a bunch of others. After a few rounds of tall ships, the knuckle draggers were gone. And we never made any mention of their existance!! They just dissapeared and went away.  This kind of thing happens all of the time. The best way to handle jammers and qwermers is to ignore them and dont even acknowledge their existance. When they find that they are not doing any damage they just go away. We had a pretty good qso right there on 3885 until the band finally crapped out around 12:30 AM.

You and I worked the other night, You had a very nice signal into baltimore with good audio, You'll nave no trouble strapping them!!

Also the shame of it all is that while all of that was going on, I was tuning around looking for another place to fire up. There was absolutely no activity of any kind between 3600 and 3700!! No ssb, no am, not even any cw!! absolutely nothing at all!! Hmmm...............
Its a shame we didnt fire up down there.

                                                                          The Slab Bacon

[ka2zni]

ahhhh.... Ok I remember working you now, and right back at ya on the fine signal and audio.

Your absolutely right on ignoring them... Best to just go on about the business at hand, and enjoy what were there for. Maybe next time we work I'll have the new Drake L4 on that I just purchased, looking forward to having that 'ole girl to play with. Be nice to have more of a desktop amplifier also with a pair of 3-500's...

Look forward to catching ya on again sometime... Thanks for the nice compliment.

[k4kyv]

They didn't bother us on 3885.  I couldn't hear a trace of them through the AM signals, and only became aware that they had moved down closer to us when I took a quick scan across the band during a break in our QSO.

Earlier in the evening I had listened to them pissing and moaning on 3892 about the "deliberate QRM" caused by a couple of AM'ers who had fired up on 3890.  The AM stations in question were both in 5-land (Texas, I think), and I doubt that they were even aware of the slopbuckets' existence.

I thought all those fancy riceboxes had some kind of roaming digital notch filter that automatically seeks out carriers and nulls out the heterodynes, even multiple heterodynes.  So what was their problem?

One remark that struck me as hilarious, while they were P-M'ing about the heterodynes from the Texas guys, one of the knuckle-draggers moaned about the fact that the night before when he tuned across the band "there was nothing but AM from 3875 all the way to 3890".

[w3jn]

these guys that run sideband on the upper part of 75 have been
on for years and make cb'rs look like good operators


that's a shame on us all

dave

It's is most certainly NOT a shame on us all.  It's merely a reflection of that particular group.  Please do not group me or anyone else in this "shame", "another black eye for ham radio", ad nauseum.

[ka2zni]

I do believe that's how it was meant... A reflection on that group and on the LIDS of the hobby, not to everyone in general.

[Jim, W5JO]

Earlier in the evening I had listened to them pissing and moaning on 3892 about the "deliberate QRM" caused by a couple of AM'ers who had fired up on 3890.  The AM stations in question were both in 5-land (Texas, I think), and I doubt that they were even aware of the slopbuckets' existence.

One nice thing about AM is that when you are listening, you don't have to hear what guys on SSB say.  I checked in with KB5MD/KC5ERI/KA5RHK about 7:45 PM.  About the time they signed Gary/CPL out of OKC said Hello at about 8 PM and we conversed until about 9. 

I heard the squalking but didn't know who or what they were saying, and they definately didn't bother us.  And with an attitude like that reported, I hope we were bothering them.  The band began to go long about 9 but it was time for a bowl of ice cream anyway.

[KA1ZGC]

I wasnt even going to fire up, but Don (KYV) came in with such a pounding signal that I fired up anyway, here comes Tom (ZGC), Mike (2ZE), Johnny (FXE) and a bunch of others. After a few rounds of tall ships, the knuckle draggers were gone. And we never made any mention of their existance!! They just dissapeared and went away.  This kind of thing happens all of the time. The best way to handle jammers and qwermers is to ignore them and dont even acknowledge their existance. When they find that they are not doing any damage they just go away. We had a pretty good qso right there on 3885 until the band finally crapped out around 12:30 AM.

This is where the right receiver becomes your most important piece of gear.

When I first tuned in, Don was talking with a KC2 station (sorry, I forgot your call). There was all kinds of lower sideband quackery on Don's upper sideband. All I had to do was zero-beat the HQ-170 to Don, flip the passband selector to "L", and it was nuthin'-but-Don from there on out, wall-to-wall and treetop-tall with absolutely no QRM whatsoever. The wannabe-jammers simply ceased to exist from where I was sitting.

After an hour or so, I flipped back to the "both" position on the passband selector, found the antics had stopped, and stayed there. It was like they were never even there.

At that point, I was able to bring the SX-62 into the equation, and had a nice, wide-open, QRM-free copy on everyone.

It's always nice to have a receiver around that's versatile in the face of hostile operating conditions, and the Hammarlund HQ-170A is very high on my list of combat receivers. At its widest, it pulls in more than enough bandwidth for okay-fine-fidelity reception. When someone gets too close on one side, you can simply flip to the other side with no real loss of fidelity. If you need to tighten up the passband, you can do so without the ringing you get from many receivers, including my HQ-129X.

We've all heard the old adage: "if ya can't hear 'em, ya can't work 'em". Truer words were never spoken, and it works in more than one direction:

If ya can't hear 'em, they can't jam ya.

Great QSO last night, guys. Had me a blast, hope we can do it again soon.

--Thom
Keep Away One Zorched Ground Conductor

[WQ9E]

I agree with Thom that the HQ-170/180 Hammarlunds work great as do the Hallicrafters SX-100/101 for choosing the sideband with the least interference.  I love the classic looks of my HRO-50 paired with the Johnson Desk KW but for a couple of weeks when I was substituting for Rob as NCS of the Midwest Classic Radio Net I also had my Drake R-7 doing receive duty so I could pick out stations through the interference.  I found with the HRO-50 that an AM station that was about 5 KCs low in frequency still sounds just fine which is not so great during heavy interference.  The Drake R-4 series also does a great job at pulling AM out through some of the worst of the antics and I had one paired with my Viking 500 for a short time while the KP-81 was undergoing restoration.

Rodger WQ9E

[AF9J]

Hi Kevin,

Welcome to the Forum.  I know it's not the easiest thing to do, but like the others said, if you can, just carry on. The nonsense you heard has been going on for a long time.  I can remember one time back in Aug. 1987, when a QSO about motorcycling I was having on 3870 or 3890 (I can't remember which) turned into a big roundtable with about 7 or 8 other hams joining in.  A couple of guys came on freq., and told us to leave because we were on "their" freq, where they met everyday.  It was explained that we were there first (and had been for a good hour plus).  Naturally being a lids, they wouldn't abide by that.  So, they jammed us!  Since I was using the Univ. of Wisconsin club station (W9YT - I had just graduated, but still had access to the club station), I had access to a homebrew KW, 3-500z amp.  I fired it up to keep on going, but many of the participants were running barefoot, and were crushed.  Still, we held them off for at least another 45 minutes or so.  As the solar cycle gets better, you'll be able to use the higher bands (when Sporadic E is happening, many of us have fun on 10 & 6m AM), and avoid this nonsense on the high end of 75.  Once I fix some receiver issues I have, and get my VFO going, I'll try to do more QSOing on 75m, further down the band (I've had better luck down around 3700-3725).

73,
Ellen - AF9J

P.S. - use one of the sidebands to beat the interfrence - now I feel dumb. I can do the same thing with my SX-96.  I know that the last few days my TS-820 has received better on 3885, than my SX-96.  OH Well.  Now I just need to check, and make sure the sensitivity is there.  BTW, do I use the 3 KC bandwidth, or stick with 5kc?

[KA1ZGC]

I know that the last few days my TS-820 has received better on 3885, than my SX-96.  OH Well.  Now I just need to check, and make sure the sensitivity is there.  BTW, do I use the 3 KC bandwidth, or stick with 5kc?

Depends on the situation. If you can get away with 5kc, use it. You'll pull in a lot more sibilance which will aid reception. Of course, if you're stuck between two AM QSOs 5kc on either side, you can always trim it down to 3kc to keep the heterodynes at bay and not lose too much in terms of fidelity.

I don't know the 96 all that well (read "at all"), but if it's got the means to knock out one sideband without having to switch the BFO on, use it. The guys on 3892 will be back for more tonight (these guys have been at it for eons), and that's the best way to deal with it. SSB receive can work also, but only if all of us are on exactly the same frequency and nobody drifts (good luck).

I'll be firing up from HLR Mountain again tonight, so if you're listening, you will hear me. From Tim's place, as Ashtabula Bill would say: "ain't a slopbucket in North America can bother me".

See you cats on 75 tonight.

--Thom

[ka2zni]

Darn... wish i could be home to say hello to ya all... Gotta head back to that 4 letter word tonight!! W**K!! 

Oh well... Such is the life... Great meeting some of you on the air, some here on the forum, and look forward to talking to all of you on AM soon...

Keep 'em at bay guys!! 

[AF9J]

I know that the last few days my TS-820 has received better on 3885, than my SX-96.  OH Well.  Now I just need to check, and make sure the sensitivity is there.  BTW, do I use the 3 KC bandwidth, or stick with 5kc?

Depends on the situation. If you can get away with 5kc, use it. You'll pull in a lot more sibilance which will aid reception. Of course, if you're stuck between two AM QSOs 5kc on either side, you can always trim it down to 3kc to keep the heterodynes at bay and not lose too much in terms of fidelity.

I don't know the 96 all that well (read "at all"), but if it's got the means to knock out one sideband without having to switch the BFO on, use it. The guys on 3892 will be back for more tonight (these guys have been at it for eons), and that's the best way to deal with it. SSB receive can work also, but only if all of us are on exactly the same frequency and nobody drifts (good luck).

I'll be firing up from HLR Mountain again tonight, so if you're listening, you will hear me. From Tim's place, as Ashtabula Bill would say: "ain't a slopbucket in North America can bother me".

See you cats on 75 tonight.

--Thom

Yes indeed Thom, I can use either sideband on AM, and get response from it (I just tested it out, on a QSO in progress).  I just have to tweak the SX-96, it's seeming to be a little weak lately.  I'd better check the alignment (It could have gotten jarred when it was shipped to me).  I REALLY need to get my VFO going.  Almost all of my successful 75m AM QSOs have been down around 3700-3725.  Also, my line noise issue isn't quite as bad down there.  I'll listen for you tonight.

73,
Ellen - AF9J
Having Technical Difficulties

[KA1ZGC]

The 3700 neighborhood is certainly fair game. I haven't been down there too much lately, in fact I was alarmed to hear Don above 3725 last night!

I'm leaving for Tim's shortly, I'll be in the 3885 area for a while. If I hear any activity down below, I may fire up down there, but it takes a few minutes to get the BC-610 settled in after that far a jaunt (depending on which antenna I'm using).

Looking forward to whomever shows up, and to hell with those clowns on 3892. Anyone who would ruin their own evening by wasting all their time and energy trying to ruin someone else's fun clearly don't deserve the good times that they're only depriving themselves of.

--Thom
Kerolene Apparatus One Zooming Golf Cart

[KB5MD]

I was informed, in no uncertain terms, by one of the 3892 group that "there is no such thing as the AM window.....".   So much for "Gentlemen's Agreements, huh?

[KF1Z]

I was informed, in no uncertain terms, by one of the 3892 group that "there is no such thing as the AM window.....".   So much for "Gentlemen's Agreements, huh?

Well.... as far as I'm concerned that's a good thing.

As was said in a thread just before the fone band expansion.... if we claim there to be a "window" that gives others the opinion that we can ONLY operate in the "window"....

As far as I know, there isn't a "window".... though others may disagree...
Well, yes... the area between 3600kc and 4000kc, that's the window...   :-)

And besides.... just who are these supposed "gentlemen" anyway ??
Everone talks about this agreement.... but never mentions WHO it was that made it...??