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Another rig question




 
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w3jn
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« Reply #25 on: March 29, 2007, 08:13:22 AM »

I ran a Cheyenne just fine with an HP32 power supply.  You hafta match the fil voltage of the HP32 with whatever the CHeyenne is wired for (either will do 6 or 12 V filaments).  Runs the relay just fine (the Cheyenne, as a bonus, includes an internal T/R relay!).  Last, you hafta adjust the bias in the HP32 to match the demands of the Cheyenne (or perhaps the Cheyenne has an internal biass adjust, I don't remember now).

6146Ws or 6146Bs work fine, in my experience, with the CHeyenne.

Don't expect miracles out of this little rig.  The loading is fixed and the audio circuit could be improved.  But it's a cute little package and works very, very well for what it is.

I believe it has a high impedance mike input and there's plenty of mic gain available for just about any mike you care to throw on it.
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AF9J
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« Reply #26 on: March 29, 2007, 09:38:11 AM »

Hi John,

Thanks for the info.  It's nice to know that I won't ahve to build up a T/R relay.  ALso, so it's a basic rig - no big deal to me.  Als long is it has decent performance, bells & whistles are secondary to me.  BTW, isn't the HP-23 supply used as part of the HP-32 (so isn't the HP-23 what I really need)?  Doesn't it's high voltage feed have to be lowered from 820V down to 600V?

Also, I have a dumb question.  It's good to know that 6146Ws can be used in the Cheyenne (especially since plain jane 6146s are pretty hard to come by).  Sooner or later the final will go out.  I have a set of chinese 6146Ws sitting around.  Orignally I bought them last year, to replace the Phillips 6146Bs that were going soft in my Kenwood TS-820.  When I used them in my TS-820, they flashed over as soon as I turned on the heaters, giving me the opportunity to open up the rig, and replace some burned out resistors on the High Voltage board, some iffy resisitors on the Finals Board, and put in some NOS PHillips/JAN milspec 6146Ws (those worked fine).  Kenwood hybrids run about 900V at the plate, so it's obvious that the Chinese tubes didn't take to kindly to the higher voltage that Kenwood hybrids run at.  But since the Heathkits run at lower plate voltages, will my Chinese 6146Ws (which are just sitting around collecting dust) be usable in the Cheyenne?

73,
Ellen - AF9J

P.S. - cute dog in your avatar (I grew up with dogs, and am a dog lover to this day).  American Pit Bull Terrier, or American Staffordshire Terrier?
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« Reply #27 on: March 29, 2007, 10:06:10 AM »

Congrats on the win, Ellen!  Cheesy

One thing to keep in mind with the HP-23 supplies is that sometimes the Collins users snag them as replacements for the 516F-2 used with the S-Line and KWM-2. So you might want to bid later instead of sooner, so as not to tip your hand too early. There are plenty of them out there, so you should be able to get one without a lot of trouble. Maybe even post a want ad in the classifieds here?

If those Chinese 6146s work out for you, I have a few NOS ones here that you are welcome to. Probably some good RCA pulls, too.

With the smaller rig, you'll be able to run low power AM in good conditions, and just add a decent amp for the evening hand-to-hand combat on 75m.

Good luck with the new project.
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AF9J
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« Reply #28 on: March 29, 2007, 11:25:54 AM »

Hi Todd,

Thanks for the offer of tubes.  Smiley  I shouldn't need any at the moment.  Like I said, I think part of the reason the Chinese 6146s give Kenwood hybrids users so much grief (don't EVER use them in a Kenwood hybrid - most of us who have, have ended up having to fix something), is because the 6146s are run at higher voltages (900V at the plates) than they are typically run at.  I have a watch out on 2, HP-23s on e-pay.  Oh, and placing a wanted to buy in the Classfieds section of the Forum for an HP-23 (or an outside chance HP-20) power supply is a good idea.  Thanks for the suggestion. Smiley

73,

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WQ9E
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« Reply #29 on: March 29, 2007, 01:53:20 PM »

Also watch for the UT-1 which was the original power supply sold for the Cheyenne, also rare but they are out there.  The supplies built for the WRL/Galaxy III and V transceivers are nice supplies which will also work and are often available cheap.  These power supplies would be oversized for the Cheyenne since they were built for higher power transceivers but the voltage should be right since the Galaxy rigs used sweep tube finals.  The Drake AC-3/4 supplies would also be okay but the price on these has really sky rocketed in the last couple of years.

Rodger WQ9E
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Rodger WQ9E
AF9J
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« Reply #30 on: March 29, 2007, 02:31:55 PM »

I have a question about the HP-23 power supplies.  What's a decent price for one?  I just put a watch on an HP-23A, and an HP-23B on e-bay, and both of them have "Buy it Now" prices of around $75.  Is this too much?  Also, which is more suitable the HP-23A, or the HP-23B?  Oh yeah, there's also another one that's I'm watching that has 2 or 3 days to go.  The high bid is at $32, and it not only has the enclosure, but the buit-in SB-600 speaker.

73,
Ellen -AF9J 
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AF9J
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« Reply #31 on: March 29, 2007, 02:36:40 PM »

Hi Roger,

Once again thanks for the info.  How much are thu supplies for the Galaxy III and Galaxy V typically going for?  Also, isn't the UT-1 the DC supply for the Cheyenne?  Is the HP-13 DC-supply adequate (In a roundabout way, I could use it, and my Astron RS-35A to power the Cheyenne).

Slaving away at work,
Ellen - AF9J

Also watch for the UT-1 which was the original power supply sold for the Cheyenne, also rare but they are out there.  The supplies built for the WRL/Galaxy III and V transceivers are nice supplies which will also work and are often available cheap.  These power supplies would be oversized for the Cheyenne since they were built for higher power transceivers but the voltage should be right since the Galaxy rigs used sweep tube finals.  The Drake AC-3/4 supplies would also be okay but the price on these has really sky rocketed in the last couple of years.

Rodger WQ9E
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WQ9E
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« Reply #32 on: March 29, 2007, 03:53:10 PM »

Hi Ellen,

The MT-1 is the mobile supply I believe, the UT-1 was named the "utility supply" and was designed for the Cheyenne for fixed station use but was supposed to be suitable for other similar rigs.  I have one that someone neatly built in to a Cheyenne/Commanche sized case complete with a speaker and analog clock timer in the front that I use with my Heath "mobile twins". 

I saw one of the Galaxy supplies with speaker go for about $35 on ebay 2 months ago.  I meant to bid on it so I could use the speaker with my Galaxy R-530 receiver but I forgot to bid in time.  Again, I imagine you can "scare up" a suitable power supply on the AM net Saturday morning as any of the power supplies designed for a Swan, National, WRL/Galaxy, Drake, or Heathkit tube type rig should work though the HP-23X supplies will have a higher than intended plate voltage. I have never used any of the DC to HV mobile supplies so someone else would need to comment on the reliability of these.

Congratulations on the Cheyenne!  You should find the matching mobile receiver now so you will have a pair of units.  If it has the original mic connector on the side it is the same connector used for old Motorola units.  If you don't have the power supply cable I believe that Leeds electronics (they are on the web) should have the connectors; these are either 9 or 11 pin "octal type" connectors if I remember correctly.  If you need to make up a power cable, heat shrink tubing is available in rolls so you can use a single long piece to cover the wires and make a neat original looking cable.

73, Rodger WQ9E
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w3jn
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« Reply #33 on: March 29, 2007, 03:59:32 PM »


P.S. - cute dog in your avatar (I grew up with dogs, and am a dog lover to this day).  American Pit Bull Terrier, or American Staffordshire Terrier?

Thanks!  Actually he's a purebred Boxer.

Don't sweat it with the tubes.  I'd use American tubes as they are more likely to take the slightly higher voltage from the HP23 (or 32, or whatever it is).  My combo worked just fine.   

73 John
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K1MVP
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« Reply #34 on: March 29, 2007, 04:24:53 PM »

I have a question about the HP-23 power supplies.  What's a decent price for one?  I just put a watch on an HP-23A, and an HP-23B on e-bay, and both of them have "Buy it Now" prices of around $75.  Is this too much?  Also, which is more suitable the HP-23A, or the HP-23B?  Oh yeah, there's also another one that's I'm watching that has 2 or 3 days to go.  The high bid is at $32, and it not only has the enclosure, but the buit-in SB-600 speaker.

73,
Ellen -AF9J 

Average price to get an HP-23A or B(a decent one) is probably around 50 to 60 bucks at most hamfests.
Of course you will pay more on "epay",--so $75 is about right.
Problem is,--you have no way of knowing how good the filter caps are in those supplys, as they
are now getting "old", so you might have to get new electrolytics.

I have found that most guys who are selling an HW-101, or SB-101 want almost as much for the HP-23
as they do the tranceiver.
Its like when buying a DX-40 or DX-60,--the matching VFO will cost you as much if not more than the
the transmitter itself.(priced xtals lately?)

                                                       73, K1MVP
P.S.,
They do make a nice power supply,--and they put out about 700volts DC, for high voltage and 275 to
300 volts, low volts --you should be able to feed either a single 6146 or a pair of them, with no problem.



 
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« Reply #35 on: March 29, 2007, 04:34:11 PM »

The point about electrolytics is a good one although careful shopping at Mouser or Digikey will yield fairly low cost replacements.  The shipping on the HP-23 will also be significant if it is traveling a long distance.  I agree that the $75 ebay price is probably a good indication of market as these have gone up in price, especially since they can be made to work with Collins gear.   A couple of years ago I was at the Peoria, IL fest and spotted an SB-600 with an HP-23B inside sitting on top of an HW-101.  I asked how much for the power supply/speaker and the reply was thirty dollars so cash exchanged hands.  I picked up the SB-600/HP-23b and started walking away when the seller yelled, "Hey, you forgot your transceiver" so it turned out to be a very inexpensive power supply.  This was the same fest where I spotted one of the more infamous ebay sellers literally tossing several Collins rigs into the back of his SUV.  Even though they were in nice shape (as they would be described in later ads) they wouldn't be by the time they made it back east bouncing around with no protection.

Rodger WQ9E
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AF9J
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« Reply #36 on: April 01, 2007, 05:53:21 PM »

Help!!!  I have a question.  I got back from my usual helping out at the animal shelter I do every Sunday, and I took a look on e-bay, and put in a bid on an HP-23 power supply.  Now here's the kicker.  I went to the Heathkit Virtual Museum, and took a look at the Cheyenne specs.  It turns out that the mobile power supply is supposed to be an HT-10.  Here's the URL:

  http://www.heathkit-museum.com/ham/hvmmt-1.shtml 

Read the section that's titled "Power Packed Performance at Low Cost"

I looked on e-bay, and wouldn't you know it, one of the e-bay stores has an HP-10 for about $40!  I'm stuck with my bidding on the HP-23 (It has 2 hours to go).  But I have a question.  If I lose the bidding on the HP-23, is it possible to use the HP-10 with my Cheyenne, and hook up my Astron RS-35A (25 amps continuous, 35 amps intemittent), 13.8V regulated power supply to power up the Cheyenne, or am I barking up the wrong tree, with a cheezy idea? 

73,
Ellen - AF9J
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« Reply #37 on: April 01, 2007, 07:00:23 PM »

http://www.heathkit-museum.com/ham/hvmhp-10.shtml

Not a cheesy idea. May be a bit kluge-y, i.e. having yer Astron supply tied up heating transistors in the HP-10.
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AF9J
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« Reply #38 on: April 01, 2007, 07:12:05 PM »

I can live with kluged together.  But it's looking like it's going to be a moot point.  With 35 minutes left, I still have the high bid on the HP-23A (a little under $26).  And, I set my bid limit at $73.  OH well.  I wish I'd know about it sooner.

Ellen - AF9J
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AF9J
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« Reply #39 on: April 01, 2007, 10:17:04 PM »

Well,  I was right. It was a moot point.  I won the Auction at $46 (plus another $20 for shipping, for a total of $66).  So, I guess I'll be modifying an HP-23A supply.

Ellen - AF9J

P.S. - now I just need to get my hands on a receiver.  e-pay's getting kind of pricey.  So, I'll go to the MARA hamfest in Madison, WI (I passed my General at this hamfest, in 1986, and Madison is the home of my old alma mater, the Univ. of WI), and see if I can get something cheaper there.  I'm open to any input on some decent AM receivers.  My criteria - can't weigh more than 40 pounds, and preferably less than 18in wide.
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« Reply #40 on: April 01, 2007, 10:43:51 PM »

Based on some advice I have received here, going small like this, if you want to stay in with tubes, I suspect you would have a hard time doing smaller/lighter than a Drake 2-A or a Drake R-4B and still do decent with AM reception, and many like (and don't like) newer Hammarlund HQ's like HQ-100, HQ-110, HQ-145, HQ-160.  But I'm no expert (I just play one on TV).

If you are will to go Solid-State, I have some affordable suggestions, like Drake SW-8, Drake SW-2, Palstar R-30 (maybe not so affordable), and perhaps a kenwood R-1000.
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David, K3TUE
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« Reply #41 on: April 01, 2007, 11:05:33 PM »

I'm open to any input on some decent AM receivers.  My criteria - can't weigh more than 40 pounds, and preferably less than 18in wide.

Tarnation! You've just ruled out all the good rigs.  Grin

Hmmm. Under 40 lbs. That's tough. OK. How about the Drake 2B? Not exactly renowned as an AM rig, but all the ingredients for reasonable AM fidelity are there. (When I was kid I used to SWL the local AM old buzzards, and they all thought the 2B was just dandy for AM) And it shore is a good looker, and approx. the same size as the GriefKit, er..I mean HeathKit.

http://www.universal-radio.com/used/u287lrg.jpg
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CW is just a narrower version of AM


« Reply #42 on: April 01, 2007, 11:27:19 PM »

The HP-23 is designed for SSB rigs but..
This is just some info on the HP-23 PS conversion when you want lower voltage, more current and more regulation on the HV. As discussed, the full wave doubler can be converted to a bridge. If you want to get fancy, add a choke as shown. Then you can get some sweet regulation for AM.

The mobile supply can be converted as well. You will go from 820 VDC at 250 mA peak to 400 VDC at a solid 300 - 400 mA. I have used this approach on Command sets in the car with modulator handled as well.

73's Mike WU2D


* hp23.gif (57.04 KB, 526x469 - viewed 1025 times.)

* hp23.jpg (124.16 KB, 922x844 - viewed 1052 times.)
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« Reply #43 on: April 02, 2007, 03:37:46 AM »

  I'm open to any input on some decent AM receivers.  My criteria - can't weigh more than 40 pounds, and preferably less than 18in wide.

Kenwood R-599A or D series is a great receiver. Great for AM/CW/SSB/FM. You can even switch the receiver selectivity from 500 Hz to 25 KHz. Covers the amateur bands but not WARC ranges. Uses some of the same or similar receiver circuitry of the 520 and 820.

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Steve - WB3HUZ
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« Reply #44 on: April 02, 2007, 09:19:20 AM »

The Drake R-4 series are small too. Some can be modded for good AM bandwidths. I had an R-4B. Even though the widest bandwidth was 4.8 kHz, judicious use of the passband tuning could yield decent audio.
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« Reply #45 on: April 02, 2007, 09:47:11 AM »

The Drake R-4 series are small too. Some can be modded for good AM bandwidths. I had an R-4B. Even though the widest bandwidth was 4.8 kHz, judicious use of the passband tuning could yield decent audio.

Agree completely. I had an early R-4 next to my bed for years and used it a lot when working around the house upstairs. Stable, lastest/greatest tube technology, decent sound with a decent speaker.

IMHO, Drake 4 Line gear is one of the best, if not the best bargains out there today. Prices are sloooowly catching up, but they've never received the credit they deserve aside from the TR-6.

The 599 twins are nice for the price, but the transmitter doesn't have 160.
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« Reply #46 on: April 02, 2007, 01:22:34 PM »

How about the Drake 2B? Not exactly renowned as an AM rig, but all the ingredients for reasonable AM fidelity are there.

I believe the 2-A has the advantage of 4.8kc bandwidth over the 2-B's max of 3.6kc.  At least that was the advice I have received.
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« Reply #47 on: April 02, 2007, 02:00:17 PM »

I don't recall ever having any Drake rig that I liked other than for use on SSB. I've had the B line, C line, TR-4C, 2-B, 2-C, 3 TR-6's including one with all the 2 meter boxes, and I got rid of them all over the years. None of them seemed to sound great on AM in their "stock" existence. Now, I'm Drake free, and don't miss any of them.
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W1GFH
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« Reply #48 on: April 02, 2007, 03:24:25 PM »

Problem with a lot of the small tube receivers are they are either "broad as a barn door" ("swl" rigs, like Hallicrafters) or narrowly filtered (Drake), with AM as an afterthought. However, if you are planning on working 75M at night, the broad rigs won't cut it. Best is to find something that gives you the option of both "widebody" and "battle" modes.
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Steve - WB3HUZ
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« Reply #49 on: April 02, 2007, 07:44:41 PM »

I've heard of a relatively simple mod that would widen the 4.8 kc  bandwidth on the R-4/A/B to around 6 kc. Anyone have this?
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