Re: Anyone know the ham that owned this rig

[k4kyv]

Probably 2/3 of those old homebrew pre-war rigs of that design were CW only.

Back in those days, many of the "real hams" looked down on phone.  Even ARRL let deriding remarks about phone slip through in some of the older QST's.  Phone was about as much a minority mode compared to CW as AM is today compared to slopbucket.

Besides, during the Great Depression only the wealthiest of hams could afford a modulation transformer. So grid modulation was widely used.

[W1GFH]

Back in those days, many of the "real hams" looked down on phone.  Even ARRL let deriding remarks about phone slip through in some of the older QST's. 

I remember coming across that attitude in the ARRL Handbooks of the early 1960's. As a bug-eyed kid, I noted back pages filled with ads for flashy SSB rigs, yet the Projects articles were abundant with CW-only transmitters. The Handbook had a huge section on CW "operating" written in scolding tones that made you feel like you were a slob if you couldn't handle traffic, copy and send flawless CW at 30wpm with a straight key while wearing a white shirt and necktie. There was also subtle pressure to homebrew -- they made you feel like a real deadbeat if you didn't BUILD all your gear from scratch.

[WD8BIL]

Thanks Sam.... now what's the story on the qsl ?
Is it urs?

[Steve - WB3HUZ]

Those who ran the ARRL in the 20-60s were most certainly CW snobs. As you and Don noted, it came out, sometimes quite clearly in their publications. Compare theTake construction projects in the ARRL handbooks of that era to those in the Radio (west coast) handbook. The differences are startling.

The QST even had a regular column called Phone Band Funnies (or Phone Band Phunnies), where phone ops were derided and made fun of. I never saw an analogous column on CW (although TOM did let some CW ops have it in his famous Rotten QRM diatribe).

The fact that we just recently got the phone portion of 75 meters increased is a result of the ARRL and their historical CW first attitude. Thanks goodness the FCC finally saw past such foolishness.

Back in those days, many of the "real hams" looked down on phone.  Even ARRL let deriding remarks about phone slip through in some of the older QST's. 

I remember coming across that attitude in the ARRL Handbooks of the early 1960's. As a bug-eyed kid, I noted back pages filled with ads for flashy SSB rigs, yet the Projects articles were abundant with CW-only transmitters. The Handbook had a huge section on CW "operating" written in scolding tones that made you feel like you were a slob if you couldn't handle traffic, copy and send flawless CW at 30wpm with a straight key while wearing a white shirt and necktie. There was also subtle pressure to homebrew -- they made you feel like a real deadbeat if you didn't BUILD all your gear from scratch.

[The Slab Bacon]

OK, youse guys, for those of you who are ham radio historians, here is a good question to ponder:

Hams, especially old hams are very set in their ways, as was the case of the cw snobs vs the fone operators. With many of the old timers reluctant to give up the past for the future, how did ssb catch on so universally over am for fone service?? I would have thought that "back in the day" it would have been a tough sell, especially to those who spent big bux building massive am fone rigs. Many times people (especially the elders) are very reluctant to give up the old for the new. So how did ssb become so universally accepted??

Just something historical to ponder.
                                                 The Slab bacon

[Carl WA1KPD]

Hi Frank

Well I would say at the time of the conversion to SSB, a lot of these guys were not yet Old Timers. They were probably in their 30s and 40s (remember this is mid 1960s), eager to try this new technology that was more efficient and did not have hetrodynes. In addition it was smaller, could easily go mobile and looked really modern.
So the leap away to SSB was no different then those of our age group who updated from say a HW-101 to a Icom digital etc.

Sam,
Do you have a larger copy of that QSL card? It is too kewl

[Steve - WB3HUZ]

SSB was invented in the 20's. It was introduced to amateur radio in the late 40's. It wasn't until the late 60's or early 70's that AM was about gone. By even a conservative count, it took 15 years for SSB to be "universally" accepted. And really, it was never universally accepted since AMers continued all along and have been on the increase since the early 70's to the present.

When you consider all the PR, education and plain old propaganda done by the ARRL vis-a-vis SSB, it's incredible it took 15 years for it to rise to a level of prominence. I think this only underscores your point about many hams' reluctance to change.

I'm splitting this topic, since it's now gone way off the original.

OK, youse guys, for those of you who are ham radio historians, here is a good question to ponder:

Hams, especially old hams are very set in their ways, as was the case of the cw snobs vs the fone operators. With many of the old timers reluctant to give up the past for the future, how did ssb catch on so universally over am for fone service?? I would have thought that "back in the day" it would have been a tough sell, especially to those who spent big bux building massive am fone rigs. Many times people (especially the elders) are very reluctant to give up the old for the new. So how did ssb become so universally accepted??

Just something historical to ponder.
                                                 The Slab bacon

[WA1GFZ]

Back in the early '60s when I was just monitoring AM ruled. The problem was as you tuned across 75 it was a series of tones as everyone packed tighter and tighter. Also ham radio ranks were growing quickly. Remember back then wondering what you call would be if you got your license this year.
Slop bucket was  a way to pack hams in tighter saving bandwidth.
The Heathkit and rice box was getting popular so there was an easy way to get on the air. Parts were not easy to come by in my area you needed buzzard connections and there were only auctions not flea markets.
A ride to Hartford to visit Hatry's was a big deal.

[kc2ifr]

I dont mean to continue off topic but I have one question.......The SSB folks condemn AM. We AM'ers like to think that we are harassed because the SSB snobs dont seen to care that AM was here first and  because we still appreciate and use the mode and that seems to piss them off. BUT on the other hand.......a lot of AM'ers piss and moan about CW. Do I see a double standard here???
Just asking....................

[WD8BIL]

Well Bill, the only P&M I had with CW was the amount of spectrum reserved for it in contrast to the amount of cw that was actually being used. Having 50% of a band reserved for a mode that only needed 25%, given its use, was just not reasonable.

Working CW, on the other hand, is still a blast .... at least for me.

[Sam KS2AM]

Thanks Sam.... now what's the story on the qsl ?
Is it urs?

Naah, I got curious about the original owner and a search immediately turned up a website dealing in postcards, etc. http://www.judnick.com/NewYorkRToZ.htm .

Old transmitter + jacket & tie  = One classy operator. 




   

[Todd, KA1KAQ]

I think the pissing and moaning had more to do with CW supposedly acting as a lid filter, Bill. AM and CW are my two favorite modes, it was just painfully obvious that the requirement wasn't keeping out the idiots, as 'JN, 'HUZ and many others pointed out. And as Buddly says, there sure was a lot of space reserved for CW with respect to the actual amount utilized vs. phone overcrowding. Not that the new space is getting much AM use.

OTOH, I think some AMers revel in the AM/SSB squabbles in the 75m ghetto/cesspool. There doesn't appear to be a double standard when it comes to stirring the pot.

[Steve - WB3HUZ]

Yo Bill. Not off topic. This thread (the one here in the QSO section) has been split from the original topic (in the eBay section) where someone asked who was the orginal owner of some transmitter. The topic here is SSB acceptance, etc.

I'm not sure who you refer to when you say AMers are P&Ming about CW. I've never heard any AM stations jamming CW Q's. Can you point me to any?

Buddly nailed it. The complaints are that the ARRL (mostly) held CW as sacred or above all other modes. Asking for parity (I hate to use equal rights) amongst the modes hardly seems unreasonable.

I think you will find many AM ops are also big CW buffs.

[kc2ifr]

Perhaps I should rephrase that statement a little. Its not all AM'ers and its really not a big thing but going back over many posts on the board and having listened to a few QSO's over my short AM career.....Iv noticed that some AM'ers think that CW is THE outdated mode and IT should be eliminated. I always felt that the AM'ers and CW ops should both be considered the anchors of ham radio.......
Again I state that I was not trying to make anything out of this.......I was just an observation...
Bill 

[The Slab Bacon]

I think that the am vs ssb squabbles nowadays are more a "turf war" thing. (Or poor operation ignorance thinking the carriers are broadcast stations like 40m) There are still a few who despise am, I remember one goofball on 40m one day telling me that "he doesnt recognize am as a legal mode of operation." I told him to go pound sand, qro'ed and "squashed him like a bug" so he had to recognize me.

But for the most part I feel its a territorial thing. Especially in the general portions of the bands. This is even more compounded lately from the sunspot cycle. I dont think the advanced and extra parts of the bands are quite as territorial, as there are less users and more room to move around.

I fired up a receiver last night, the only am that I heard was the "keep 3872 away from the macaronis" group they were getting hammered and clobbered, and there was no activity on 80 or 85 at all. There was also no am activity down lower in the band either. I shut off the  receiver and went upstairs.

But if you go back and think about it, it must have taken one hell of an influence to make ssb the "universal" mode of phone operation.

                                           The Slab Bacon

[Herb K2VH]

KS2AM said:

"Old transmitter + jacket & tie  = One classy operator."

Check this out for classy.    That's the old homebrew rig that I run to this day, though I later put pp 100THs in it.  It looks just the same -- very old buzzardly.  Pardon all the scratches. It was taken on a Polaroid.
 

[kc2ifr]

Herb,
Is that rivets holding that thing together?
Bill

[Steve - WB3HUZ]

Him or the transmitter?

Herb,
Is that rivets holding that thing together?
Bill

[kc2ifr]

Very good Steve.....I cant stop laughing......wonder what Herb has to say???

[Herb K2VH]

Hey, Wise A$$e$ -- Those are screws with washers -- and yeah, they're holding me together in case I have too much Vodka.

Vodka Herb

[Pete, WA2CWA]

I always felt that the AM'ers and CW ops should both be considered the anchors of ham radio.......
Bill 

No group or mode should ever be considered as "anchors of Ham Radio". That's part of the perceived problems on the air.

[kc2ifr]

Pete,
Lets get one thing straight.......in my mind because I feel the way I do about that has nothing to do with my attitude about the other modes. My thinking has to do with the romantic feeling I have about the hobby. As a kid, listening to all the hams on an S38 in 1958, my memory's  about the AM'ers and the CW ops makes me feel all warm and fuzzy. I do not expect u or anyone else to remember my past or my excitement as a kid. Lets get one thing straight........... my opinions are just that......my fuc#$^ opinions. If u think for one moment u will spoil my that....u better think again. Your attitude and opinion mean NOTHING to me. As I said.........my post was just an observation........if u dont like it.......turn the dial.

[w3jn]

Hey, Wise A$$e$ -- Those are screws with washers -- and yeah, they're holding me together in case I have too much Vodka.

Vodka Herb

What about the vinegar... heard something about Vinegar Head one time 

[kc2ifr]

Hey Mr. Rogers,
I started this thread.........dont forget that!

[kc2ifr]

True,
But sometimes us folks get a little sensitive about our posts.....I dont mean any harm to anyone...but I am realistic in my views. Dont leave....I for one enjoy your opinions.
Bill