The AM Forum

I had an interesting QSO tonight with Bob/W2ZM.  After a coupla hours chatting about general stuff, I stated my opinion that in 30-40 years we would hear dead silence on the bands due to the dying out of us buzzards, lack of interest and no newcomers to fill the ranks. The last CQ would go out with no answer.

Bob came back and disagreed, saying that ham radio will be here far into the future, packed with hams and activity. He said that the ranks will be filled in the future by new guys entering in their thirties and forties who now have time for leisure and toys.  He mentioned that younger people are too involved in their lives of earning money and raising families to bother with radio. But it will become a great outlet for later in life.

I thought that made a lot of sense and it swayed my old opinion. I'm usually an optimist but ham radio's future had been an exception.

What really hit home was when two guys broke into the QSO. One was in his middle thirties and the other was about 45 years old. One said that 90% of the hams he talks to on the air are in their 30's to 40's. The other guy agreed!!!  I was really surprised to hear that. Though, maybe it's just that they are attracted to this age group, being one of them, and seek them out.  Both agreed with Bob - that they were hams when young, dropped out for college / familiy raising and now have come back with money and time  - and love it!   But, what if they were never introduced to ham radio when young... would they "come back" then?  One also said that their generation introduced the new digital modes, PSK-31? and a few others I didn't even recognize... ;D  With more exciting stuff to come and attract new people.

Today, the internet grabs the young kids.  I feel that from the 1920's to the 1960's,  maybe the big trend for kids being in the hobby was a one time event, never to be repeated, simply because of no internet and cell phones. Ham radio was all they had for communications adventure back then.

So, the consensus was that ham radio will live on forever, just that it will become a hobby that attracts an older crowd after the family is raised, etc..

What do YOU think??

73,
T

Well if W2ZM said it then I believe it, Bob is usually correct on most things relating to RF.

My own take is a bit different. I have been a SWL since I was a young JN, about 12, but was first licensed when I became 30 years of age. I quite quickly grew bored of plastic radios, and after setting up an automated digital amateur satellite station the "wow" factor went away and I turned to the vintage gear. It helped to have a great Elmer who was a vintage enthusist. Actually, may be that is the key here, a good Elmer, will address that later.

For three years after I moved to Maine I was a co-instructor for folks interested in getting their Tech and General class license. Most of my students, not all, but a good many are more active on 2 meter CB than on HF. A number simply never upgraded because of the CW requirement, others just wanted a local “intercom”. A shocking number confessed to just learning the answers rather than bothering to get excited about and understand the theory behind radio. Those that stuck with 2 meters by and large do not understand what I term as the magic of radio, and have been the quickest to leave the hobby.

I am an also the Portland VE Liaison for the ARRL and hold bi-monthly license exams with a team of fellow amateurs.
I have been a VE since 1995 and have seen a steady decline in the number of candidates, and sadly, the number seeking higher license classes.

So perhaps the answer is how we define “ham radio”. If we define by any operation, not just HF, or HF only, then there will still be folks interested in the hobby. But I will say that in my experience the average new “Joe Ham” has shown little interest in theory or learning to build.

This may explain what I sense to be a decline in the standards, knowledge and operating practices of many on air today, especially newly minted SSB ops.
The polite and civil operating best practices, asking if a freq is in use, QSYing when needed, seem to be replaced with the radio equivalent of “road rage”.
I always enjoy hearing and working elder hams, they tend to have the well developed on-air behaviors and I learn a great deal from those folks.

Earlier I mentioned the necessary of having a good Elmer. Lately I have been encouraged by those in the AM Community welcomed SSB ops who have discovered the “AM button” on their riceboxes. Thats a solid first step toward understanding radio's magic.

The “Magic of Radio” is not something that can be bought, it must be learned.
I recall my wonderment as a teenager hanging a piece of wire out the window, and listening to all of these far away places on my DX-160.
Today, the new amateur is sadly often “sold” radio as two-way intercom with their buddies. CW, naw that's old fashioned, use FM instead.
It seemed to me that we have dumbed the hobby down to the lowest common denominator. Obtaining a license is now almost a right, not a privilege.
And we wonder why people drop out of the hobby? The answer is simple, we sold them defective goods, instead of teaching them the magic, and we sold them a free cell phone. The time-honored concepts of elmering, and home brewing are looked upon as archaic, even backward.

If amateur radio is to be saved, it won’t be the ARRL which does so.
Instead I believe it will be the job of you and me to share the “magic of radio” .

Personally, I'm much more a "quality" than "numbers" person and would rather see a smaller number of amateurs, who are skilled and really love the hobby, than a large influx of folks who jumped the fence because the League felt it necessary to lower the standards.


-Bruce W1UJR

I think Bruce has certainly described how things have changed.  Whether the hobby as we know it can survive into the future is looking doubtful to me, too.

It's easy to make a case for either eventuality, however.  Of course, predicting the future is... well, we here in New England always curse the weathermen, despite the scientific basis of their predictions.

It might be more realistic to pose the question, "What are hams doing to shape the future of ham radio?"

The "hobby as we know it" is actively promoted here on this website.  We have a niche within ham radio which represents a relatively small number.  And yet, we do have an impact and we do have an influence upon the issues that concern us.  Despite our small numbers, we are doing something to shape the future of ham radio, just by continuing to keep this website active.

The future of ham radio, though, isn't on this website.  It's in the heart of some kid that you haven't come in contact with yet.  It's in the curiosity concerning those antennas in your back yard that a youngster in your neighborhood has yet to build up the courage to ask you about.  The future resides in the unshaped ideas that one kid in 500 has yet to be affected by your going into the local school and volunteering to do a demonstration of ham radio.

We know what percentage of the population is interested enough to get a license.  It's two tenths of one percent.  It means that you have to expose a thousand kids to ham radio in order to get the two that will find it "right up their alley".

Will ham radio last forever?  It's up to you and me.

Jeff
KA1OGM

Hi guys,
Last summer I had the opportunity to lead a ham radio camp for middle school kids. They were interested, enjoyed radio, enjoyed building a kit, and went home with a radio and a built kit. That's the future and I am optimistic . . .

Art

Yes, it will still be around, vibrant and active.

It will probably be accepted, by then, that the growth curve need not be more than barely above flat. Right now there's a camp who believe that's not healthy, but they fail to recognize the throwaway communications society we live in.

Down below, AB3L said There is always going to be the technology interested student out there who just might trigger some interest in radio. You just have to spark the right energy for them.

This is where we can hope to draw young people, but we as a hobby should not spend too much of our effort recruiting from there. It makes far more sense to target the older demographics where people have the time and disposeable income, combined with a historical appreciation of radio, to draw them into the vintage aspect of the hobby.

You think the group in Newington would realign its recruitment along those lines? No way.  That's why it will be an individual effort, plus group efforts like this web page, to introduce and draw from existing hams who have grown tired of plastic radios and having everything pre-determined from a menu.

Our best bet is to get people re-connected with the function of playing radio, and that's why the vintage part is one aspect that holds allure.

Ham Radio has a future and it will be different from the way things are now....However, We must remember the vintage modes ,operators, and gear that got radio started and work to preserve them...We can't let the foundations of Ham Radio be eliminated just to say we are making room for the future....

RIGHT ON!

I've always been fascinated by the constant hammering by the ARRL and various space cadet groups that "We've got to attract young people to our hobby". This has been the single biggest argument for the dumbing down of the hobby. My god, the extra class test is now about as difficult as the novice test I took about 40 years ago. So what if the hobby slowly dies? Lots of hobbies have become passé and been reduced to a fraction of their peak size. I don't see it as a bad thing. Sure we may lose some frequencies, but if there are fewer hams, doesn't it stand to reason we don't need the same bandwidth? Truth is, the ARRL is only interested in protecting themselves financially. If they could double the dues, they'd be content with half as many members. Personally, I'd rather see our hobby slowly die with some dignity, instead of what's happening to it.

73,
Darrell, WA5VGO

Over the past 10 - 15 years the trend I have seen is the entry into the hobby of older people who were exposed when they were young and now retired and want to take up the hobby.

Sure the growth curve is flat, but as long as we have a significant presence on the bands, it will remain alive to some extent.  One advantage of older people entering the hobby is they tend to be more level headed and think things through more thoroghly.  We should tap this resource when answering petitions from the ARRL more often.

It is nice to have the younger generation entering the hobby, but that is almost akin to flogging the dead horse.  We also should be recruiting those who have the time now that they are retired.  Once they reach that stage, they are not as interested in the cell against the ear nor typing on a keyboard.

I think it comes down to exposure.

My initial venture into radio was triggered by listening to KDKA as a kid. They had a guy named Don Chuliano(+/- on the spelling) who would man the shortwave radio there and record the foriegn broadcast news services for replay. That knocked me out so that led me to getting a GR-64 to see what was going on.
That interest in radio got me a meet and a chat with my Uncle's childhood ham friend and shortly after my novice license. Burt, W3ENM had been in the war, and as many guy's at the time, had used ham radio as a means of getting back home. I remember him running patches back for a guy in the Canal Zone all of the time. It was cool and had that important side to it. Exposure.

The greatest thing lately for exposure, in my opinion  has been the ham link to the space station. This has great impact for the kids just as the items I mentioned affected me in my youth. Radio clubs had to deliver the event to the student in school knowing they might not find it out in their neighborhood.
There is always going to be the technology interested student out there who just might trigger some interest in radio. You just have to spark the right energy for them.

Amateur radio could have had geat public exposure thru the unfortunate events in the last few years. Hams have shined with their volunteer work yet nobody seems to really hear about it. Maybe nobody wants to admit that the amateurs were the only ones to get things going when there was nothing else. These "special interest" public service stories could have been a great tool to lure the interest of kids but did anything come out of that? Not as much exposure as it deserved.

Most parents have fear for their children anymore from the internet, to even walking down the street. When I was young I remember walking up to a house with an ham antenna in the yard. Turned out to be a nice contact as the local ham was glad to show me around the station. No problem.
Things have changed, for one thing you don't see many antenna's in neighborhoods anymore and parents might be a little less likely to let their kids alone with the "wacky" radio guy down the street. Less exposure.

On a personal level, my eleven year old has no interest in this. I have tried many times to het him on for the Kids Day events. He just doesn't want to do it. Video games and reading occupy his off time here at home, he loves it. Hockey has taken up the rest of the time for the both of us.
It also apparant that today's kid is accustomed to the instant gratification medium out there. If they can't get it now their interest will go onward to the next hit..learning CW is out.

Bottom line is, I think ham radio will be around in some form maybe not for the same reasons that we now find interest. There will be something to grab interest for the newcomer. Ham radio will have to sell itself thru good volunteer service, considerate practice, and thru it's relation to emerging technology. We have to sell it to others. ;)



(fixed a typo)--VJB

The ARRL is looking out to save their "collective butts", pure and simple and this recent
"election" of a "new" president just proves it, IMO.

They are in "big time denial" on many issues, when they say that the "magic" of HR
can still be captured as it was years ago.(with the internet,cell phones,etc, etc)
The facts remain, it IS NOT the same world it was 40 years ago, and most youth are
NOT impressed with ham radio in 2006.

Why do you think ham radio has been "dumbed down" especially over the past 20
years?--maybe to get the numbers up?--but the league STILL "touts" the present
exam system as "just as hard", if not "harder" than the exams were years ago.

Why would that be?--well maybe it has to do with convincing newcomers that their
"instant tickets" are really worth something, and then get them to join the ARRL,
get QST and BUY the "new" high tech megabuck radio`s.
 
In closing,--My oldest son,--a EE with Raytheon has often "chuckled" about ham radio,
in that he views it as "arcahic",--see`s Dad with the antenna`s and radio`s and "shakes
his head".--That tells me a lot.

IF ham radio is still around,in 30 years,--it sure will not look like anything most of knew
back 40 years ago,--probably will look just a "high powered CB service" with many
more "appliance operators", IMO.
 
                                              73, K1MVP

If we stop with the condescending attitude towards new hams (and ESPECIALLY no-code techs), have interesting and fun conversations on the air, and promote technical advancement (IE get hams to understand whatever facet of the hobby turns their crank), we'll go a long way towards  keeping ham radio alive forever.

There's generally no problem with any of this at all within the AM community.  The fact that AMers tend to be more fun (and less bitter about life) and build/fix/restore/etc is the main reason I became active again after the sheer boredom of SSB.

If you ever delve into the hell that is qrz/com you'll see plenty of condescention towards newcomers (people with avatars proudly proclaiming that they are a "20 WPM Extra", etc) and pissing matches at every turn.  Hopefully we'll see these bitter OM's gear on eBay and we can make room for enthusiastic n00bs who are sick of the bitterness.

73 John

Some of the sharpest people I know could barely pass 5 WPM
A 20 WPM Extra

I tend to agree  with what MVP said above. However, I think there will always be a small contingency of  persons, yopung and old, who find ham radio interesting in one wayor  another. But face it. The ability to have your own radio and antenna and to be able to talk cross country and around the world lacks  the excitement, thrill, awe and appeal  that it once had.  However, I doubt that in a decade or so the FCC will be issuing ham radio licenses anymore. Atsome point they'll  probably  wash their hands of it altogether.

Amen !!  Instead  of rejecting the new no-code licensee's and turning ones back on them help  them along. Make them feel welcome. Help  them out. That's right. I get sick when I see  these guys with these attitudes of "hey, I'm a 20 wpm  extra that makes me better  than any no-code newbie". Screw that attitude and welcome the newcomers aboard.

Agreed! 

Yep, in reality, except for outselves, no ones really cares about our personal accomplishments. Maybe our best friends will pat us on the back, but that's it. I try not to have expectations of others, thus little disappointment when they don't do what I expect...and hopefully vice versa. 

It doesn't matter to me how hard I worked to get the Extra Class. It's a personal thing. If somebody pays to have another sit in for the test, well, that's their shallow accomplishment. They'll burn outa the hobby in no time anyway.   It's what you put in is what you get outa this hobby.

Unless someone is a rare breed who just likes to talk, buying a complete station from mic to antenna installation results in a short ham career.  Mix is some challenges, like earning the ticket, specialized antennas, HB rigs, modified gear, serious restorations, etc, and you have a real hobby to stick with fpr a long time.

T

I argree,
That just because a guy can do 20wpm and "beyond",--does not necessarily make one
"good" technically.

Have seen this many times (in my experience) both in industry and the military.
Many non-hams were great techs, that I worked with,--some even better than some
of us hams,--but I do know that HR did help me in being a good tech.
I DO NOT blame the newcomer for the "mess" HR now finds itself in,--BUT do feel
the ARRL did contribute to the problem back about 20 years ago ,IMO.

I still believe its a "leadership" problem,--with the "old boy" system in Newington.
Again this recent election of a "new" president says a lot, IMO.

It would seem to myself and many others that the ARRL is mainly interested in
"cookie cutter" hams, and is very leary of maverick type hams, and could even
view those of us in the AM community as "maverick"-- and/ or "outlaw hams",-- as
many if not most, may not fit into the "cookie" or "plastic" mold, IMO.

Also agree with W1UJR, that ham radio will not "be saved" by the ARRL.
                                           
                                               73, K1MVP
 
P.S.--As far as the 20wpm cw exam,--at least it did help "weed out" those who
      had a real interest, versus those with a "superficial" interest, albeit not a "perfect"
     filter, as it did require some work.
     I really do not care if the cw requirement is eliminated,--but the exam methods
     should be "revised" or "changed",--again just my opinion,--otherwise the FCC
     might just as well start "giving" tickets out to everybody and anybody.
     This is where many of us OF`s think HR is headed, at the rate things are going.         
 

"Also agree with W1UJR, that ham radio will not "be saved" by the ARRL."


HA!  The funny thing is that WE may have to save the ARRL some day.  The last time I looked at their public financial statement a coupla years ago, the Leaugue's net worth was down to around JUST two million dollars and had just taken a multi-million dollar slam in the stock market. Hopefully, things have come back a little in their stock market speculation activiities.... ::)

As I said once before, if I were an officer or employee, I would be doing everything I could to get more members/dues, and get them on a stronger financial footing. I would be very concerned whether  my pension was going to be there  or not, after I retired. THAT probably has a great influence on many of theiir decisions these days. Wouldn't you be concerned too?

As for becoming the prez of ARRL?...  My hat is off to anyone who takes that thankless job. No compensation, other than travel expenses, etc... A time sink. You gotta love ham radio to do it and love the recognition, I guess. God bless 'em.

T

Yes, you  are right. First let me  say  I agree.Having passed the 20, or even 13 wpm code test maymean little to others.  But we do have every right to take pride in ourselves for having put in the time and effort  and having made the accomplisment.

I also feel that a ham radio license is something that should be earned. If not  by code proficiency then by some other means. There  ought to always be some levels or standards that indicate some  levelof interest  and dedication.

But most importantly I think the worst thing that hams  can do is to shun the newcomers. Be they no-code or whatever we should  try  and help  them along the road to improving their skills and teaching them what we know.  I am sure many of them will make excellent hams if we help them along. And who knows, we may even learn a few thbings from them along the way.

Just a thought... Perhaps we need to bring more females into the hobby ?? Maybe that  will encourage more males to join  up with the expectation of meeting the "girl of their dreams"over the radio ?? Maybe the patriarchal structure of ham radiop has outlived it's usefulness. Perhaps  ham radio will  have a brighter future as a coed hobby ?? Any thoughts ??

"But most importantly I think the worst thing that hams  can do is to shun the newcomers. Be they no-code or whatever we should  try  and help  them along the road to improving their skills and teaching them what we know.  I am sure many of them will make excellent hams if we help them along. And who knows, we may even learn a few thbings from them along the way."


So true.

We are judged on how we treat others of lesser experience or stature in life.  Notice how friendly and helpful most corporate execs are the higher you climb... and how much "lording" goes on as you go into the rank and file.

When I hear an experienced ham stop to take the time to welcome a newcomer and make him feel good about his new accomplishments, no matter how minor, I gain a greater regard for him. This guy has a healthy inner-confidence and self respect.

T

Never would you HAVE TO save the ARRL.  It's just a commercial entity. 

We could form a new amateur radio lobby group from scratch.  And there's no requirement for this new "national association for amateur radio" to be a technical publishing house also.

So true, Tom.  Anything is possible if ya have the motivation and love for the hobby, as Hiram once did.

T

John,
This issue did come to my attention about 3 or 4 years ago when I became
involved in "mentoring" and talking to "newcomers".
I found that many,(including a 20 wpm extra) did not seem to have an
understanding of "basic electronics", and seemed not to really care about
learning.

Started asking myself,--"what is going on here"?
I began to question the exam system,--and the more I "looked",--the more
the exams questions,(and methods) seemed to be at fault.

Prior to this experience(as I was real busy with work es family)--I just was not totally aware
of just  how bad the exam system had been compromised.

Another thing that happened  about this same time,--was a friend of mine mentioned that he was involved in administering exams for a few years under the VEC system ,and told me "it was a joke", and a "waste of time",--and I asked "why is that"?

He said that at any given exam session,--a person was allowed to "retake" the exam
as long as he just kept paying the exam fee, until he passed.--thus it was a "joke"
in his opinion and felt he could no longer "play the game".

Another experience,--was when I was working on a homebrew AM modulator,
a 20 wpm extra,--asked me "whats that"?-- I said an AM modulator,--he then said
what is AM?
I then really was "appalled"--a 20 wpm extra did not know what AM was.
Again,--I do not blame him,--but do fault the exam system for not at least covering
some AM basics somewhere along the "exam chain".

As far as getting female`s interested,--there is another problem in my opinion.

I had just finished doing the AM,(HLR) mods on my FT-101 and happened to be
"tuning around" on 75 AM one day, and I was showing my youngest daugther
the "beauty" of AM, and would you not know it,-- some guy was on, "GDing this and
 GD that"-- and she says, "dad what is that",--I basically had to apoligize and
tell her that this type of behavior was/is not "right".--and after that my attitude
toward getting her interested in HR went down the tube.
If I did,--I would probably restrict her to cw, and forget the phone bands.
                                  
                                        73, K1MVP

P.S ,some would say, I am being "overprotective",--have heard that before.    
  

Rene, people just arent going to understand electronics unless they WANT to.  Even then they'll have to stumble across a group of AMers most likely to mentor them and give them correct advice instead of hammy hambone lore.  Ain't no test in the world is gonna guarantee hams have a good *understanding* of electronics.  ANd maybe that's the way it oughta be.  There's plenty a room in ham radio for those that ain't electronics wizards.  Corntesters, DXers, traffic handlers, etc., don't need to know how to modify a ricebox.  And maybe someone doesn't know a cathode from a collector but is shit hot on antenners.

There's room for all, and while we can laugh about some of the sillier comments we hear remember none of us (except maybe the Tron) was born with an innate understanding of radio theory.

You gotta kinda wonder though if they aren't interested in what makes a radio tick why they chose ham radio as a hobby....

73 John

Yep, you raise some excellent points and I largely agree with what you have said. And no, you are not being overly protective. A number of years ago I had a girlk friend visiting. She was a pretty tough, hardened New York City girl who has seen and heard it all, not the type  who is easilly shocked or offended by anything  and yet  she was quite amazed and perplexed  and turned off by some SSB activity she heard on my ham receiver.  She eve asked, "does  this go on all the time  on the radio ??  Are most hams this silly and pathetic  ?",  Fortunately I was  nearby and I had explained to her that occasionally some guys get a bit silly and carried away with themselves  but such behavior is sproadic and certainly not a viable representation of what ham radio is all about.  She understood but it did lead me to the realization that first impressions can often go a very long way in determining the kind of inpression about something that one will gather and carry with them for years and years to come,.

I think the question about bringing more females into the hobby remains on the table, unanswered.  We've all heard inappropriate language on the bands...no less appropriate for female ears than anyone else's.  There's more to it than that.

We feel it's important to bring young people into the hobby.  How do we feel about bolstering our numbers with women?  How do they rank vis a vis slow-code or no-code extras?  Women often seem to be more of an excuse to end a dull QSO -- "XYL's calling" -- than people we actively want to include in the hobby.  A lot of hams are in the hobby because it separates them from the XYL.

My own sense is that ham radio is cirling the drain...maybe that's just evolutionary.  We're reluctant to embrace people and ideas that differ from our own.  Or, once we accept them, we're anxious to help them become like us.  The hobby persists largely because of a dedicated group of hams, few of whom will be around to have this conversation in 25-30 years.  Natural selection...unless we can diversify the age class and gene pool...or find the fountain of youth!  IMHO.   

I do not agree that ham radio is such that it "excludes" YL`s or XYL`s ,--
With today`s "requirements" being much lower than they were back 30 or 40 yrs ago.

If you look at many of the "old" QST`s of years ago,--there was a YL column and
there were in fact YL`s,--even back in the 30`s and these gals were licensed hams,
long before the "watered down" requirements.

So I don`t buy the "gender discrimination" card.
Difference was--IMO, was that people in general back then, were not afraid to put
a bit of effort(including YL`s) to achieve a goal,--and that included getting a ham ticket
.
My contention,--is that we will NOT attract young people with any amount of
enthusiasm and intelligence with some of the "crude" behavior out there on some
of the bands.

Then again,--this crude behavior may be a sign of the times",-- as I witnessed  in parts of the military,-- with some YL`s, especially in certain career fields such as "aircraft crew-chief"
and a few others, that were traditionally male career fields in the past.

I also noticed, that females in other career fields such as avionics, or personnel, seemed
to be much better "behaved"--these were fields that required more "intelligence"
and "common sense", IMO

The net of it, is --I do not believe we will be able to attract quality ,males or females to HR if we do not "raise the bar", instead of "lowering" it.

                                              73, K1MVP         

We most certainly are NOT going to attract ANYONE to the hobby with content-free "Hi Hi Fine Business and 73" QSOs.

So-called "crude" or "embarrassing"  behavior is relative.  If someone is "disgusted" by what they hear in a typical QSO on the ham bands, we certainly don't need or want them in the hobby.  All they're gonna do is gripe, and try to devolve everyone into those wretchedly boring QSOs. 

Conversely, if it sounds like a crew of peeps are having fun, I submit that is MORE attractive to newcomers.  Ham radio is SUPPOSED to be fun, isn't it?!?  Why not SOUND like you're having fun on the air?

The last time I demonstrated ham radio for a non-ham I had the misfortune of talking to some knucklehead who interspersed "hi" in between each sentence, and used "we" when referring to himself.   It was incredibly embarrassing having to explain that particular mental deficiency to my visitor.

73 John

Hi Hi Hi Hi, OM!   ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

We were laughing so hard that we forgot to slam the XYL today so we can have some more harmonics and ham tickets - hi hi.  BTW, the WX and XYL are both FB hr.  We gotta go to the salt mine now. 73's's's's... and 88's's's to your XYL too... [you don't mind me 88ing your XYL, do ya?]

T

I see we're back to the Jiggly Jugs avatar.  K1JJ = K1 Jiggly Jugs  :D

My wife has expressed interest in ham radio.  The only thing stopping her from doing it is studying the theory. She being an artsy type she can't grasp the technical side.  She loves the social side of HR.  I'll keep working on her though. 

Bob wins the prize for jj..............

There are several issues in play here:

1) Gender interest, or lack thereof in the hobby

2) Young people getting into the hobby

3) Retention of existing hams

I think that JN has a point, the overuse; perhaps I should say abuse of CW prosigns is a bit embarrassing. I understand it, often do it myself, its kind of an insider thing, like a secret handshake, using QTH for home, WX for weather, and QTF for…well QTF. But it does sound weird and geeky to the outsiders. And I do agree that “hi” only has a place in CW, just laugh if you want to laugh!

As to your points about YL involvement Rene, you're right.
I am forever reading older QSTs and there certainly seems to be a much higher level of interest and acceptance by the female gender. YL columns in QST, YL nets, really quite different than today.

On the other hand, it used to be "cool" to be a ham radio operator; there was a mystique about the amateur service (notice I use “service”, not hobby) back then. After all there was no Internet, VCRS, DVDs, computers, television and even broadcast radio was new fangled. Hams were seen a good thing, a brave adventurer sailing forth to serve mankind, even as clever, almost magical folks who created strange and unusual gadgets in the basement to talk with the world. Certainly we were not seen as the awkward, socially inept, conversationally challenged, pocket protector wearing nerds that we are stereotyped as today.

Take a look at the typical hamfest photo from the 1920s-1930s, it looks for all the world like a formal gathering of gentlemen at some elite private club…which indeed it was.

Radio was much more seen as a “service”, relating daily messages and news of disasters, not the social distraction it is today.

Of course the America of the 1920s-1950s was a much more kindler, gentler nation. The mother stayed home with the children, father came home to dinner on the table, Sunday church, and everyone looked out for everyone else. Folks liked simpler lives and had more quality time for hobbies like radio. Just a tad bit different from today’s world where both parents work, the kids are home alone entertained by MTV and the Internet. Now many are mortgaged to the hilt, working 24/7 to pay the bills and credit cards. Any wonder why the interest and civil nature of the hobby has declined.

The changes in ham radio, I’ll avoid using the word decline, are echoed across the board at all “fraternal” organizations like the “Eagles”, “Moose”, even Rotary International. It seems to be me that our society is focused on “bigger and better” rather than on quality of life. That may change with the next generation; one thing that I have noted about change, is that the pendulum always swings far too each side before settling in the middle.

Perhaps future generations will be more focused on family and home and less on the material things. Then ham radio will represent a rich alternative to be explored.

For me, I am very glad and blessed to have what radio offers me today.
Great frienships, advetnrue, challanging learning, and fun in both restoration and opearing.
Amateur radio is a rich, delightful and wonderful service, and I am not embrassed for one minute to admit that I am a ham.

73 Bruce

Good to hear from you Bruce,

As far as CW "prosigns",--I would guess it depends on how you view ham radio.
Many, if not most of us "old buzzards", entered the ham ranks via the old novice ticket
which coveyed mostly CW privileges,(not rights) and we really did experience the
"magic" of HR on the novice CW bands.

We,--or many of us did not view the novice ticket as "inferior", and were actually
very thankful to acquire the "beginner`s" ticket and had a "blast" working lots of
ther CW stations.--Not all of us viewed CW as a "burden", or "hardship".
The net result many of these "pronouns" were picked up and became "habit",
and yes,--it also conveyed a "fraternity", and "pride".

The same was/is true IMO, when an individual joins the military,--one joins, goes
to "basic training", or boot camp, and then spends a "stint" overseas and/or stateside
and becomes part of a "fraternity".
After one gets discharged,--one still share`s a "commonality" that can be shared
with almost anyone who has been in the service, even though that person may
have never served with that particular person.--It continues to be a "fraterity" even
after "retirement".--One can swap "war stories" with another and understand
lots of "military acronymms", and "pronouns" so to speak.

Serving in the military also conveyed a sense of "healthy pride", in accomplishments,
like completing basic training, or a "tech" school, etc.
Now most people I know,--do not consider the service "elitest",--maybe certain
"special forces",--or "green berets", but in general the regular service is a "fraternity".
Nothing wrong with that,IMO.
So that is how I view the HR community,--there is "diversity" whithin it,--some of us
like AM, some of us still enjoy CW,some SSB(ye gads) and I see nothing wrong with that.
                                             
                                          73, Rene, K1MVP

P.S,--Some of the guys I served with still get together and share experiences, now
       that we are "retired".--We don`t consider ourselves an "elitest" club.
   
P.P.S,  CW to many of us OT`s WAS ham radio, as it was our first experience and
          we grew to "love" cw.--I sure learned a lot building homebrew cw gear
          both solid state, and tube stuff.
       

My use of the word “elite” as in “elite private club” was actually intended entirely in the positive, so hope you didn’t take offense. Frankly I think the concept of “elitism” or “de spirit de corp.” or whatever you may call it is a wonderful and healthy mindset to have. You expressed it with ex-military folks, same thing. As for CW, its the heart and soul of the amateur service, no arguement here.

In fact one of the main points of my posting is that is this very mind set which I feel the hobby lacks now. We tend to treat radio as a hobby, rather than as a “service”. Its difficult to justify the large and very valuable spectrum we have been granted – think about it, what other group has exclusive use of such a tremendously valuable public resource – unless we provide a service for the public good.

I know you’ll appreciate this, check out the latest old buzzard addition to the hamshack http://www.brucehowes.com/national_sw-5.htm

 “bigger and better”  = Straaaaap

I guess I'll put in my two-cents worth...

CW-lingo is no different than this on-line anacronysm crap such as IMO, BTW, LOL, ROFLMAO, etc. Yes, I see it right here on this board, too. The present-generation of kids and adults do not see anything wrong with that, it's just the current trend of today's internet society. If people today think our old ham radio anacronyms and prosigns are 'geeky', they should be gently reminded of what they are doing. But since it is accepted and trendy in today's generation, it would not register anyway, at least IMO... Isn't that annoying? :D

One aspect of the hobby that is following a societal trend that I can't stand is being lewd, crude and obnoxious... and being GLORIFIED for it! Why don't we try and behave like ladies and gentlemen for a change instead of acting like complete alpha-hotels??? Yes, it is a turn-off to outsiders when they hear this garbage being spewed over the ether. We are a minority already, epecially being AMers. Why not put more effort into conducting ourselves properly? I have my own example to share regarding this...
 
My kids were very small at the time, and a particular New England ham with the usual Big Signal and Broadcast Audio answered my CQ. I purposely made mention to him in the beginning of the QSO that my children were in the shack with me, marveling at all the radio equipment. Well, the hint went unheeded and he carried on like he always does, with all the usual bodily function noises and unacceptable remarks. That really angered me, since I specifically told him my children were present. That kind of nonsense does NOT belong in our hobby. It comes down to nothing but pushing the limits to see what you can get away with. If you want to be a shock-jockstrap, do it somewhere else, not in our hobby. People are being paid big money out there to act like idiots and low-lifes in the entertainment industry, so go make some real money if you feel like you need an audience. >:(

Okay, I'll step down off my soap box now...

Every now and then we see a hot woman walking around Hostraders. Ever wonder what she is thinking on Saturday morning after most of us have spent the night in the car sleeping off a party.
Maybe we need to improve our image.....3 months to get the tux to the cleaners..

It's not a question of using CW or ham lingo or not.  It's a question of mental sanity - ie, what kind of person talks like this, and what kind of image does this project:

"Name here's Fred, hi.  Our QTH is Bedrock, hi.  We're running Apache #7 with D-104#3, hi.  We eat only lime Jello here because our wife just died of a horrible painful disease, hi.  We just got done washing out our cat's boil, hi..."

All well and good to say 73, QTH, etc on phone.  But saying "HI" to laugh and using the royal "we"...?  C'mon.

73 John

Hi John,
Cw "lingo" did in fact serve a "real purpose" at one time,--to abbreviate words in a
cw qso,(contact) for a good reason, along with "Q" codes, as I am sure you must
know.

I know many are even "offended" if a guy uses "phonetics", even though there are
perfectly " legitimate" reasons to use them at times, especially when band conditions
are poor, and the guy on the other end is having trouble copying.

As far as "C`mon", or "caw`man",--or "10-4 good buddy",--seems to me like this
comes directly from the old 11 meter band, and what "good purpose" did it
serve? --other than "infest" the ham bands with "CB jargon" in my opinion.

Maybe its no wonder some people can`t tell the difference between CB and
ham radio, amongst many other reasons.

                                          73, K1MVP

P.S, the term,"handle" originally came from hams,--NOT from CB,--it was the CB`ers
       that picked up the term from hams, especially during the "CB fad" of the 70`s,
       when truckers started using the term,--"handle".
       I know many are surprised when you tell them that.

   

Yeh, plenty of us use "caw mawn" etc in a humorous manner.  Too bad there are some that don't get the joke.  Of course the 'ultimate' ham radio insult is to say someone sounds like a CBer  ::)

Nothing wrong with using ham radio jargon - hell, the AM community has its own subset - but saying "hi" instead of just laughing?  Caw mawnnnn.... ;D

        "All well and good to say 73, QTH, etc on phone.  But saying "HI" to laugh and using the royal "we"...?  C'mon. "

       Its O.K. when one has critters.....      klc

My previous call sign (n1eba) warranted the use of phonetics.  When I would give just the letters the person coming back would either say n1epa or n1eda.  No matter how hard I tried to create a distinction between the E and B it would get butchered.  So I used phonetics then. I  had a couple of phonetics I used besides the basic ones.  I had N1 Extremely Big Appendage, or N1Extremely Big Antenna.  Neither were true.   Now I don't have the problem and don't need phonetics to often with the current callsign. 

I guess I don`t understand,--why is it ok to say 73, or QTH, which is a "derivative"
of cw and the "old days", but its not ok to "laugh" by saying "hi, hi".

Or --its also ok to use  "C`mon" from the CB fraternity.
I really don`t care what a guy uses for acronyms, or abbreviations as long as
the QSO is "civil",--but then,--the definition of "civil', is up for "interpretation"
in today`s world of ham radio.
 
Guess,--I just may head back to the cw bands, where its still ok to use these
"acronyms"
                                        73, K1MVP
  
                                                    

Rene, why say "hi hi" when just a laugh will do?  It certainly has its place on CW where it's generally used as an emoticon, but if you're saying "hi hi" without laughing, you're really saying that it isn't in fact funny at all.  Whatever floats yer boat, man, but what started this threadbuster was my embarassment at a visitor who was incredulous at someone saying "hi" and "we" on the air....

BTW I've actually heard Irb laugh on the air  ;D

73 John

Ok John,
I understand what you are saying,--and I personally do not say "hi hi" on the air, BUT
my point is/was that  there are other things that bother me a lot more than some guy
saying "hi  hi" or "we", such as some of the "crude" or "obnoxious" behavior,
 i.e.,"GD" this and "GD" that.

I can relate to your situation as far as being "embarrased" with a visitor in the shack,
when this occurred,-- BUT I also had a visitor in my shack when a guy was "GDing"
this and that on AM, and guess what,--my "visitor" was my young daughter.

I really would NOT have had a problem with the guy saying "hi, hi" or "we" when she
was listening, but the profanity DID bug me.
So much for demonsrating ham radio,--and getting her interested.

As I mentioned before in one of my previous posts,--if  she did get a ticket,--I would
require her to learn CW and restrict her to the CW bands.--with a k1 cw tranceiver.
SO thats my "take" on this issue.
                                         
                                            73, Rene     

Perhaps in these trying times it best to recall the "Radio Amateur's Code", akin to the "Gold Rule" for radio relations:

The Radio Amateur is

CONSIDERATE...never knowingly operates in such a way as to lessen the pleasure of others.

LOYAL...offers loyalty, encouragement and support to other amateurs, local clubs, and the American Radio Relay League, through which Amateur Radio in the United States is represented nationally and internationally.

PROGRESSIVE...with knowledge abreast of science, a well-built and efficient station and operation above reproach.

FRIENDLY...slow and patient operating when requested; friendly advice and counsel to the beginner; kindly assistance, cooperation and consideration for the interests of others. These are the hallmarks of the amateur spirit.

BALANCED...radio is an avocation, never interfering with duties owed to family, job, school or community.

PATRIOTIC...station and skill always ready for service to country and community.

--The original Amateur's Code was written by Paul M. Segal, W9EEA, in 1928.

Even worse, more than once I have  heard phone ops use it and pronounce it "aitch-eye."

I don't have a problem with hams using CB lingo that is obviously intended as a joke.

Unfortunately, too many hams who use CD lingo are not using it as a joke.

Yes but if you look at this one, you will see that it has been corrupted to:
Never!!

Ok Bruce,

 Those "golden rules" were written in 1928, back in the days when society still had some "sense of decency", and "perversion" was not the "order of the day" as it is nowadays in many places in society.--totally different world in 2006, and many call it "progress".
 
   Lets run through them real quick,

#1 CONSIDERATE--look at the top end of 75, especially in the evening and see how
     many are "considerate" of others.
.
#2 LOYAL-- another problem in 2006,--does the ARRL really deserve "loyalty" when
      it does "its own thing" and does not seem to care about its members?
      How many are loyal to their employer`s  nowadays,--but then do companies
      (especially the big ones) care about their employees?
      What "goes around comes around".IMO
     
#3   PROGRESSIVE-- again, how many keep abreast of what is going on in HR
       technically, or events that can/ or do effect amateur radio?
       Seems to me there is a lot of "ignorance" and/or "apathy", IMO in 2006.
       I know many that do not even know about the present proposals that can/or
       will effect ham radio in the near future,-- lots of indifference and apathy,IMO.
 
#4   FRIENDLY-- most hams are, BUT there again,--there are still some who are not
       very "welcoming",-- Look at all the "infighting" there is today, that did not exist
       back in the 30`s, 40`s and 50`s.

#5   BALANCED--there again,--many do have problems "balancing" HR with outside
       responsibilities, probably the cause of many "ex`s".

#6   PATRIOTIC--many like to think they are "patriotic", until it comes time to "pay the
       price",-- like service to their country.
     
       The picture may look "bleak", but one would have to have their "head in the sand"
        not to see the reality that exists nowadays,--again, my opinion.
                                 
                                          73, Rene,(MVP)

       P.S/, and some still claim "this is your father`s ham radio" , like the ARRL?
               A bit of "denial" maybe, or "rose colored glasses"? 

there was just has much infighting in ham radio back in the 30's as there is today, in fact more of it. Read ur history in the QST's, while sanitized there's still much talk of drunken late night operating under the influence of demon whiskey. People used to play music all over 160 back then - there's a big long article about how bad the Class B operators were on 160 fone in one of the issues.

Nothing has changed. It's the same today as it ever was. It sounds the same today on AM as it did in 82 when I got on for the first time. Everybody thinks their circumstances are original and different than what went on before, but the truth is that people stay the same, only the tech changes, and in AM thats doesnt even change very much sometimes. :D

With all due respect,--I am going by my experience,-- when I entered HR back
in the 50`s,--not what I have read in old issues of QST.
There may well have been "some instances", but I will wager not on the scale that
now exists.

Just look at the "infighting",-- am`er versus am`ers, SSB versus am`ers,-- cw versus
am`ers,--digital versus cw, and or am`ers, and you name it.
NCT versus "general", or "extra",-- old extra versus "extra lite", and you name it.
"homebrewer"' versus "Appliance op" and the list goes on and on.

Many of us old timers  blame the "watered down" exam system, and cw requirements
being lowered, now on the verge of being eliminated,--and guess who pushed
for all this about 20 years ago,IMO--The ARRL, the NCVEC, the "powers that be",
the Dick Bash "PC" instant ham ticket method system.

Acquiring a ham ticket began to lose "credibility", with the "new instant" day classes,
and why do you think the "powers that be" pushed for these methods?
Might it have something to do with getting the numbers up?--in a frantic attempt to
save ham radio, by the league and others? 
Again,--am going by by experience over the past 46+ years.
                                             
                                           73, Rene, K1MVP

P.S, 75 meters,(especially at the high end) sounds like CB on any given night,IMO
      20 meter SSB has been "invested' for a long time,(past 20 years)at least and
      I have even heard some on 40, which always used to be a "cleaner band".
      With the soon to be eliminated cw requirement,--the bands will really take
      a "downward spiral" with many new NCG`s and extra`s on the phone bands,IMO.
                

All I know is that the bands sound the same way now that they did back in the early 70's when I was a little kid listening to my Radio Shack Astronaut 4 portable. I do listen sometimes through the computer. Some people dropped mauls and threw carriers, and played music and others didnt. Do you know where I heard the word 'FUCK' for the VERY FIRST TIME? Some drunken freak in 1973 dropping a hammer on 75 meters talking about how his wife was cheating on him. I was listening on a brand new Drake SPR-4 at a buddys house. We giggled our asses off becuase we knew it was naughty. :D I was in the 4th grade, I think. So experiences differ.

With all due respect, I'm going by MY experience, which is entirely subjective on both our parts. The rest of your comment I dont have anything to add to, except to say that judging one by age (more > better) only works to the point at which you begin to slobber and drool and forget all that stuff you know, and you will reach that stage sooner than I. :D

OK and I can understand where you are coming from.

Back in the early 70`s,-- I was just starting a family(was in my early 30`s) and was not as active on the bands as I was when I was first licensed.
(As a youngster, got interested in 55 and did a lot of listening from 55 until I got my ticket in Dec of 59).

When I did get on in the 70`s, I would usually get on 20 and 15 to chase dx once and a while, so I seldom if ever got on 75 and 40 meters.

I also was not on AM at that time,--(mostly slopbucket chasing dx) and can see where
I might have missed out on the some of the "crap" that was going on at that time.

It`s too bad that ham radio has "degenerated" into what it has,--and its also my
contention that it will only get worse with the present "proposals" from the ARRL
to get the numbers up, which will create more "chaos" on the bands, IMO.
.
I can also understand why you might have gotten "fed up" with this crap,  after your experience as a youngster.
The 50`s(when I was a kid) was  a "kinder gentler HR" and this behavior was not
the "norm",  IMO.

In closing,-- am also at the point where I am ready to "call it quits", and/or "scale back"
and maybe even return to cw, and go back to having "fun" where their is still a bit
of "civility" with OT`s.

It`s too bad that many have bad experiences as newcomers, and thus either got "turned
off" and  never got on, or got out real quick because of some of this behavior.

I really believe this year will one that will be a "defining" year for HR,--"for better or worse". A lack of leadership from the "powers that be" that started years ago has contributed to this "mess", IMO.
                                             
                                          73, K1MVP
         

Rene said:
Rene, there is still fun to be had. I still enjoy the QSO's on 160 meters. There isn't near the amount of garbage there as is on 75M. Frankly stated, people aren't going to go through the trouble of putting up an antenna system just to 'rain on everyone elses parade'. A for instance: last night while in a QSO with N3IBX, K2DK, & KK4AM, some sloppbucketeers snugged up tight against us creating some QRM. I quick fired up my ricebox, (yeah, I openly admit I have one), told the gentleman the situation. I use the term gentlemen in the real sense. He told me why he was there, (bumped from another freq) reduced his power and we try to slide a little lower. Everything was civil and I thanked them for that. So not everywhere you go will you find crap. I'm not saying the band is completely devoid of it but not to the extent of 75m. You will even find that kind of thing on CW also. I been there and done that.

It always comes down to the glass half empty or half full thing, doesn't it? Ultimately, we define our own happiness/enjoyment. Letting others define it for you only means you'll be unhappy most of the time.

PMing is normal for this time of year. Usually I hear more guys wanting to give up the hobby, in disgust, than at any other time.

As everyone knows, these channel conflicts are much more frequent in the winter when the band is long. Especially now that the solar minima is here making the 75M/ 160M  band even longer -  and also bringing guys down from the dead higher bands to crowd in below.

In addition, you will notice there are many more conflicts in February and March as cabin fever peaks.  The combination of these four factors should make for all time big numbers in battles coming up, so be prepared to have lots of patience.

In contrast, during the late spring to fall, the frequencies are much quieter due to burn out, the local signals dominate the farther out stuff and things return to normal.  It won't be long before the big, local roundtables on 75M return and everyone is having so much fun this is all forgotten until next year... ;D

T

Well there may be some "truth" to what you said about the glass being "half full"
or "half empty",--but many of us see the water in the glass as a bit "murky" or
"poluted" and to pretend that the water is "nice and clear" at this point amounts
"denial", IMO and many others, who view ham radio in today`s world.

You are also right in not letting others define "happiness" or the "state of affairs",
thats why I choose NOT to let the ARRL define the "reality" of ham radio today.

                                           73, K1MVP

P.S., --as far as "P" es Moaning,--I really DONT care what people think or call the
         "pointing out" of the reality anymore.--I used to, when I was a JN,--
          those days are gone.
P.P.S., the cw bands are looking more attractive to me every day,--may even
          have to "fire up" the little SB-200 on cw and put up a better antenna.
          I had originally got the 200 for use as an AM linear,--well, I just may have
          a "change in plans" due the the "changing enviroment","CAW--MAN"
          Man, I cant believe I said that!   

             

Quite some time ago, it occured to me that the reason ham radio doesn't attract more women is because it's half-duplex, ie- you have to listen all the way through the other person's transmission, and you can't interrupt...

Jeff
KA1OGM

Eureka!
It took three pages, but finally now have the answer!!!!!!!!!  ;D

Good point John!

I bet that many folks don't realize the "caw mann" expression we joke about is actually a reference to the on the air lingo used by fellow AM'er Jim N3JUH..... from Penis-el-vania!!  ;D ;D ;D

Certainly a "subset" if ever there was one!...... ;)

Want some real insight?
I'm going to ask my two high school aged kids what they find both interesting and otherwise about ham radio. My son is the same age as I was when my HS science teacher loaned me a Knight CB set to listen on...And when my great aunt gave me on old tabletop BCB/SW receiver to play with. Both of which opened a new world for me. Neither of them have *any* interest at all in dad's hobby.

Hey, maybe receiver manufacturers need to stat putting SWBC back into their AM-FM radios?

I agree 100% with the notion that it's the challenge of any hobby or endeavor that attracts the best and brightest to it. Make it a "gimmee" like CB radio, and you just turned off the very kids that you want to attract.

A few days ago I attended the high school science fair that my daughter had a project on photosynthesis in. I was astonished at the wonderfully creative projects, research and ideas  these kids presented. More than a few were absolutely brilliant science projects, both well thought out and documented. There were a number of projects concerned with electricity and electromagnetism. Then you ask: "How do you spark an interest in Ham Radio?"

Where's a kid get a shortwave receiver today?
Not at the flea markets any more.
Not from Aunt Margaret.
How do you hang a wire antenna or VHF yagi in the 90% of today's housing developments that prohibit such things? Where do they find an Elmer when most of us old ham buzzards are buried with the daily responsibilities of life and work? How do you lure a kid off his media-rich internet-connected computer to a pile of radios?

It's not just ham radio, there's a whole bunch of hobbies and interests that just aren't being pursued any more in this 21st century..Who collects stamps? Model railroads, anyone?

Ah, I'm not being constructive...And rants aren't helpful either...
;-)

For several years I was a judge at the southern MN regional science fair finals, and likewise was astounded at the quality of projects - most of these kids came from very small rural schools.  I must have judged 500 projects over the 3-4 years I did this, and not a single radio related project amongst them.

And that was back in 1984-88.

I really gotta dispute that things are getting "worse" on the ham bands.  As Derb pointed out, and anyone that's spent any time at all with a collection of QSTs from the 20s-30s-40s, there were people belching, cursing, and getting drunk on the air.  There were innumerable territorial and mode battles.  Anyone remember the slopbucket vs AM battles of the 50s and 60s?

It's more of the same as in the 1930s except the contestants are older and more bitter.

73 John

I really gotta dispute that things are getting "worse" on the ham bands.  As Derb pointed out, and anyone that's spent any time at all with a collection of QSTs from the 20s-30s-40s, there were people belching, cursing, and getting drunk on the air.  There were innumerable territorial and mode battles.  Anyone remember the slopbucket vs AM battles of the 50s and 60s?

It's more of the same as in the 1930s except the contestants are older and more bitter.

73 John

I find it really "interesting" that many who were not even on the air back in the 20`s
30`s, 40`s, 50`s and even 60`s can "attest" to the "fact" that things were just as
bad back then as they are now.
And all cause QST "said so",--well,--with the present situation with the ARRL, and
its "credibility", or "lack" of it nowadays, I would also question its "credibility" even in
the past.
So much for "politics",--even back then.
                                            73, K1MVP 

Hmmmm. So the statements don't fit your viewpoint, disparage the source. Quite convenient. But, it wasn't just QST. The same stuff was in other radio mags of the time, most notably Radio. Also, much of what I've read in QST about the problems of that era were letters from hams, not QST/ARRL staff. If you want to claim these were fake or edited by QST, then the proof of such a claim is incumbent on you. Without such proof, I accept these statements as fact.

Otherwise, I must reject your memories of the 50's as false, and driven only by politics. Being obtuse can be very easy. ;D

My oldest son is almost 14 now and in 8th grade.  I was 13 and in 8th grade when I got my ticket.  He has absolutely ZERO interest in hamming, though he admits to curiosity about the code.  My 5 and 7 year olds like the idea of being on the radio, but of course they really don't understand waht hamming is about.

The magic, the mystique of radio is a big issue.  Even when I got my Novice in 1975, radio signals from far away were mysterious.  TV from across the big pond still had the little caption "live via satellite" on the screen. Now every other home has a satellite dish.   I remember having a 2m hand held in my pocket in the late 70s and it attracting honest curiosity and good questions.  Now every kid has an 832 chennel full-duplex digital transceiver in his or her pocket.  Folks knew what ham radio was back in 1975.  Now I bet most people have no clue what "shortwave" means.

The mystique is gone, technology has surpassed it and what we found magical is now every day. 

The age issue is valid.   When I was a Novice, at least half the contacts I made were with kids around my age.  Teenagers were on CW in the 40m Novice band.  Why?  Well, if you wanted to be on the air as a Novice, you got on CW.  It never occurred to any of us to question why we had to learn the code, we just did.  And most of us had fun.  I know I did.  31 years later I'm still almost exclusively on CW.

We live in a throwaway society.  Nothing gets fixed anymore.  So why should we expect kids today to learn how to do something nobody else does?  Nobody except hams for the most part anyway.  I fixed TVs in a TV shop when I was 15.  (I was in the company van on a road call when the radio came on and said Elvis was dead.)  Nobody fixes TVs now.  They swap boards and toss the old ones.

If I had the means and the room, I'd have some boatanchors here, probably be on AM with you guys some too.  I've NEVER cared for the sound of SSB.   So yeah, I'd be on with you and I'd be keeping my fingers in the tech stuff.  But not today's equipment.  Yeah, I have a ricebox - a Kenwood TS480. I confess I wouldn't even think of trying to fix it.  But I was busy, like everyone else, trying to finish college and feed my family when I could have been keeping up with technology.

I don't think it's really worth expecting most hams to know how to get deep into today's rigs, but when I realise most posters on qrz.com talk about the dipoles they bought, the G5RV that doesn't work and I realise that even something that simple has been dumbed down, we're past being in trouble.

Yes, ham radio will survive.  I've no doubt about that.  My question for the last 15 years or so has been "but will ham radio be a ham radio I will want to be part of when I'm old."  Due to my declining health I'm not likely to ever be OLD, but I still feel for those who will miss out on what could have been.

We will always have lots of licensees, but will we have enough hams?  I dunno.

Rant over!

Hmmm,--there is plenty of "obtuseness" at the top end of 75,on both AM
and "slopbucket" nowadays, IMO and many others.'
Reject my opinion all you want,--I stlll stand by my statement.
Where were you in the 50`s, and or 60`s?
Again,--you may look at the water glass as "half full" if you want,--but as I said
before,--it(the water) looks real "poluted" to many of us OT`s who used to drink
"clean water".
                                       73, MVP

P,S, --if the future looks "so great" in HR,--why is it there are only "minimal'
        comments in response to the bandwidth petitions with only about a week
        to go?--even with the ARRL "advertising" their "great proposal"?
        I happen to think the manner in which the ARRL is attempting to
        "jam down" these proposals is very "obtuse", or "political", IMO

P.P.S,--last count was only about 200 comments on the CTT proposal,
          and about 300 on the ARRL proposal,--sounds me like,
          a, Indifference, or apathy
          b, ignorance
          c, don`t care
          d, all of the above

          The same held true when it came to the license restructuring propsals,
          there were only about 800 comments to RM-10867 as I recall.
          Now with about 6 to 700,000 licensed hams,--I would call that a real
          "dismal" response,IMO,--or am I being just "political"?

                                            73, again
                   
 

You left out choice "E"...

Hams that feel their "comments" won't make a damn bit of difference in the end regarding an FCC decision.
Wishful thinking is nice but lets talk reality..do we know for a fact that these comments will influence the FCC's decision? I think this process is being confused with a vote, which it is not. If this was in fact a vote, I think you would see a much higher level of activity..

It's easy to brush this off as apathy, but as much as we don't want to believe it, this may just be the FCC going through the motions.... I don't believe anything will change...."Same as it ever was"

Yes, I filed my comments....

Rant over...

Not if we let them operate full duplex. Then they'll feel right at home.

John said, "Not if we let them operate full duplex. Then they'll feel right at home."
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Actually, John, even full duplex won't do the trick, since other people can listen in...

Jeff
KA1OGM

I always thought that that was the "whole idea" of ham radio, --to be able to
"listen in and talk to the world", and as such was NOT a private phone line last I knew, anyway.
 
Heck, even this am-forum is not "private" and many "tune in" just like radio.
If I want "privacy",--I will use my telephone, or e-mail someone directly, although
with present day "hackers",--that privacy is even questionable, as far as I know.

                                     73, K1MVP

Email is anything but private. When you send an email from point A to point B it often "hops" from machine to machine leaving a trail that can be read along the way. One of my duties at work is a systems/network administration  in which I have access to all the mail spools. As a matter of principle I wouldn;t do this but, if I wanted to I could read any incoming or outgoing mail passing through our servers. Additionally all the incoming and outgoing mail is archived and retianed for years. 5 or 6  years from now someone could read a email that  someone sent through our system today.  best way to reduce the liklihood of emails being read by anyone other than the person they were intended for is to use some type o9f encryption like PGP.

Most "private" type  communication is a hand written message hand delivered directly to the intended person or, meeting with the person directly and  talking to them in private.