The AM Forum

You can see my antennas and the Hy-Tower, one dipole I do not use fell
Not much of a video, but if you are bored......
Irene
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tN7BOtsLp8Q

Consider yourself lucky Burt

Burt,
       For once (and this time only) I have to agree with you. The local news was going for 24 hours telling everyone to "hunker down", put your head between your legs and kiss your a$$ goodby. We did get torrential rain and a little wind, but that was it. It really wasn't worth staying up most of the night for. Although the local news anchors were looking like they were rode hard and put away wet by the next morning  ;D  ;D

I don't know about most of you jabrones, but back in the summer 1972, a lazy catagory 1 hurricane came strolling up the coast and wore out it welcome. Its name was Agnes and was one of the worst natural disasters to strike our area in over 36 years, (at that time). There wasn't any trees toppling over or roofs being blown away. But it rained, and rained and rained. When it got done raining, it rained some more. Sunbury, PA experienced 8" of rain in a 12 hour period alone. This storm had that same potential. To say that the media was 'chicken-little' is a farce. Ask some of the people that lived in Scranton and Wilkes-Barre back then and tell them what you think. You're liable to get an earful!

I doubt that any storm causing millions/billions in damage and numerous deaths could accurately be called a "fraud", though the choices in reporting left a lot to be desired. Two things to keep in mind:

 - While the storm wasn't what it was hyped to be for most areas, it wasn't a non-event, either.

 - The Weather Channel, like most of the media, is all about ratings and viewers, not necessarily good journalism or accuracy.

I found the local coverage to be spot on with minimal hype. National coverage, especially from TWC, was much more of a staged End of the World scenario. As the storm was churning across NC and heading north, TWC spent much of their time on their big name personality who was in Battery Park in NYC, telling people how the water would be over over his head, 11 feet deep there in just a few hours, mass destruction, etc etc. Didn't happen, though inland areas like VT really got hammered with rain and associated flooding. You could hear the disappointment in their voices as they scrambled to find anything that looked bad. One of the announcers on TWC even said "we've at least found some flooding on Long Island we can show you".

The other thing the media does that seems pretty pathetic is harping endlessly on evacuating; telling folks to get out of the area, stay off the streets, stay inside, etc. Then they send reporters out to stand in the storm and 'report', to build up the drama. They go out of their way to point out how dangerous it is to stay behind after being told to evacuate, then they seek out people who aren't evacuating to interview. Which message is the right one?

Local media, though not 'hype-free', seems to be much more on target and to the point overall. They based their reports on the National Hurricane Center releases and stuck to them without pumping it up with a lot of theoretical nonsense. Truly the difference between reporting the news and trying to create it. The contrast between the locals and more ego-drive national media was quite stark, right down to the reporters dressed up in their foul weather gear for on screen reports after the storm had passed, while folks walked behind them in shorts, T-shirts, and sandals with no indication of rain. Reminded me of the woman reporting from a boat during flooding in some town a few years back, and a local walking through the shot behind her with the water not quite knee-deep.

We consider ourselves lucky here, though the good wife is a Tampa girl who has been through a number of big hurricanes over the years. Others weren't so lucky even a few miles away from us. But overall, the storm was nothing of the huge catastrophe for the east coast that it was hyped to be, basically for the areas in the path that are known to have water problems during big storms. And the poor choices in reporting it are exactly what brings about the feeling with the general public that it's no big deal the next time.

 

Guess it depended on where you were. In Scituate, MA. I had tree come down across the road that blocked it until the town came with a front end loader and pushed it back up on my front yard. My neighbor on one side had a tree come down through his back roof, the other neighbors also lost trees that fortunately just missed cars. These were oaks.
So many trees came down that took wires with them that they say we won't get the electricity back for awhile.
For once I am glad to come to work where there is power.
Regards
Q

When Agnes hit you it was not even a tropical storm, but it did get stuck in one place. Most of the time weather people exageratte, occasionally like in your case they under forecast. Media 90% of the time is chicken little, you got the other 10% and if they could have hyped it, they would have
Burt

Your comments ought to be aired on every network, everyplace, your thoughts are exactly what I think but in no way could I be as good as you in expressing them. Great work.
Burt

Seems like the people here in upstate NY are feeling the effects first hand from the storm. Many people have died, other lost there homes. Seems all too real to me.

Here' a link that will give you some idea what we are seeing. Vermont had record floods as well.

http://www.timesunion.com/ (http://www.timesunion.com/)

It knocked out phone/DSL and power in parts of Ohio too.

At least 35 deaths....

http://www.ajc.com/news/nation-world/hurricane-irene-blamed-for-1150358.html (http://www.ajc.com/news/nation-world/hurricane-irene-blamed-for-1150358.html)

Fraud?  Simply because many were not affected does not mean the media was not justified in warning people to be diligent.

Having been through quite a few storms in Louisiana, I can tell you that many of them are largely a non-event for many people.  We breathe easy after such storms.  This storm COULD have been utterly devastating to many more people along the Eastern seaboard.  There's no way of knowing until the thing has passed. 

Now you say "oh the media hyped this way up".   Along comes Maria (theoretically) in late September, maybe a much more compact storm with Cat 3 winds rotating around the eye and it's out there south of Bermuda but Providence, RI is where she is taking aim for landfall.  The media goes to work issuing warnings and saying this could be the Big One for the area.

"Oh the media is at it again, hyping this way up, trying to get everyone to watch them for their ratings. I'm going to get me a case a Samuel Adams and some chips and dips and ride this baby out on Cape Cod because of course this is just going be some wind and rain, no big deal."

No Fraud here in southern Maryland.  We've got the damage and a few deaths to prove it.

About four hours before storm passage conditions were so bad that law enforcement and fire service was withdrawn from the roads.  It was agonizing to listen as the dispatchers and paramedics debated whether individual calls for medical assistance were worth risking EMT lives.

Bill

p.s.  Burt  I didn't see you cutting loose those makeshift guy lines on the HyTower!  ;)

I guess the proper term should have been hype instead of fraud. The local news purveyors here were just preaching the worst possible gloom and doom. Like this being possibly "the storm of the century." It actually got on your nerves after a while. But our local news idiots are good for carrying the hype to extreems. The damage was very much "area specific". With many areas just getting a good soaking.

I spent the whole night of Hurricane Agnes out pumping basements out and pulling swamped cars out of the water, and the whole night of Hurricane David babysitting an entire marina full of boats, so I have been out in a few of them. (Including this one)

However.................. The thunderstorms that pummeled us here last weekend were by far more violent than Irene that we saw here. If you would have seen the news anchors here "embelishing" the story You would have either laughed or puked. Especially after they ran out of new news to report. The best part was watching them wither away from being in front of the camera for so long. They looked like they had "been run hard and put away wet."

I can just imagine the smell of fraud when I open my fridge next weekend after the power was out a few days.
You always have a choice when the TV is on...to turn it off
Ralph has a fraud tree you could take down for him Burt.

Carl,
       I hate to say it, but..............THAT GUY MUST HAVE BEEN AN IDIOT! ! ! ! ! !
That is like sticking your head in an aligator's mouth and crying because he bit the top of your head off! ! !  We should nominate him posthumously for a "Darwin Award".
That's like a "once in a lifetime" chance to commit suicide...................

You guys just keep getting sucked right in, don't ya?  ::)

Precisely. I don't think anyone (at least, not me) is saying otherwise, John. Having spent close to 25 years in things like firefighting, SAR, and emergency comms, it's never a good idea to downplay or ignore the evidence. The flip side of the coin though, is that hyping a situation without significant information to warrant it, is just as reckless.  

"Could be" is much different than "is going to be", which I heard numerous times. Nothing at all wrong with warning people with stark information of what is possible from a storm. It's actually a good idea. IMO, it's completely irresponsible to pump it up through catchy phrases or otherwise. When you have "200 meteorologists covering this storm" and a lot of airtime to fill, it's a recipe for a lot of unnecessary comparisons and misinformation to fill that time and appear interesting.

Not sure if you intended it this way or not, but you basically reinforce my point. Whether building it up into some great, scary event, or continuing to do so even after the evidence is showing otherwise, it gives people less confidence in what you're saying and makes them less likely to take it seriously. Crying wolf, if you will. Toss in the 'made for media' moments shown on the weather channel and elsewhere, along with saying one thing ("stay inside, it's not safe to be out in the storm") then doing the opposite, well - I think the term 'mixed messages' is putting it kindly. People should evacuate, yet we're going to scoop the competition by interviewing someone who chose not to. More brilliant, made-for-TV moments.

I lost count in the last few years of how many times these self-described experts have said we're in for another bad season of hurricanes, only to have it not happen. Sometimes they even attribute it to global warming or climate change. Then it doesn't take place. Apparently Irene was the first named hurricane to make landfall since 2008. The truth? Every year we're in for hurricane season. Some COULD be utterly devastating.

Forecasting is not a perfect science, which is why you seldom see the actual folks from NOAA making such dire predictions. Rather they use words like 'possible' instead of 'likely'. When you're trying to be seen as the source for all things weather, it's no doubt easy to overdo it in hopes of garnering more viewers.

The disappointment from TWC was palpable, no doubt a huge let down from the job they did in convincing themselves at least that they had a major hurricane story on their hands. It is, was, and will be for weeks to come. Just not to the extent they seemed to be hoping for. That's the pathetic part.

But there should be no mistaking bad media for actual events, threats, and so on. There is nothing even remotely resembling fraud for the outcome of this storm, only on how some chose to represent it. To those who lost homes or loved ones, I'm sure it feels as horrible as it gets.

Folks:

While it is interesting (I find humor in it) to see TV folks show us the hype of "deteriorating conditions", and the cameras frantically search for and amplify extreme video while the TV reporters stupidly put themselves in harm's way for the camera, it is up to each and every one of us to take in the information we can get and make personal judgements of what to do during these weather events. Having lived through many dangerous hurricanes, I know it is better to be prepared and take a proactive position.

The TV stations, with their hype, are doing what they are designed to do-make YOU watch them-and YOU did! As I work in the TV industry, I watch what is happening with an understanding of how and why it is done. To get an accurate picture of such an event, I watch the TV station's radar and what the meteorologists are saying. These meteorlogists are trained and often do not hype a situation. You will see this contrasting the bozo reporters and anchors saying the world will end, right after this commercial break...

I also also look at web sites such as the National Weather Service http://www.nws.gov/, the National Hurricane Center http://www.nhc.noaa.gov/, and for my area, the Eastern Mass ARES group http://ares.ema.arrl.org/. These are great sources of information that have no hype and no stupid reporters exclaiming "deteriorating conditions" while standing in a puddle in 50mph winds.

In the end, I'd rather have to filter through the hype to get good information and be prepared than not have it available and get blindsided (for a view on the professional TV hype, see here: http://www.tvtechnology.com/article/123854). There are folks who have had light to extensive personal property damage (look at the flooding in Vermont for example). I bet these folks are not thinking Irene was a nuisance. Me, I am very happy to have only lost part of a fence.

I knew Irene would have reduced power by the time it got to Massachusetts (as an average, due to the water temperature, a hurricane will reduce by one level as compared to the level it was in the tropics), but was very pleasantly surprised that the storm reduced so much. I am thankful, and we were lucky.

I also saw many folks in the northeast not preparing at all or completely (like leaving yard furniture and trash out. I actually saw a desk out for trash pickup Saturday and it was toppled over today. I also saw construction plywood loose at a house that was being renovated). When a level 1-3 hurricane hits up here, these folks will not fare well.

In New Orleans, there are many folks who become numb to the "cry wolf" syndrome of the media. Many of those folks died in Katrina and Rita. When state or federal authorities say to evacuate, DO IT! There is a good chance it will save your life.

Here you have to be a smart consumer, just as in many other areas.

Be educated, prepared and be safe.

Dan

I suppose the worst thing is, for those area who weren't hard it, next time there is a big storm the reaction will not be to hunker down and prepare, but a lot of folks will just recall what was said and happened and the difference.  It's one thing to tell people to prepare for a bad storm (this is good reporting) it's another entirely to hype it up so badly that the media looses credibility.  So the next time, some folks won't be so quick to prepare.

A lot of folks died, but I don't think that the Surfer who drowned, and the Canoeist should be blamed on the storm.  That's just plain dumb.

An example of over-hype is what happened in the Philadelphia area after the storm had passed. All 4 networks, instead of resuming programming with occasional breaks for updates, spent 6 hours showing viewers photographs that had been sent in, often not even knowing where the photo was taken or what area it showed. If I'd wanted to see them I could have gone to the website. I didn't need to see a TV screen showing a computer screen while somebody clicked on the thumbnails to enlarge the pic.

Larry

As is becoming clear to me fraud was not the best word, over-hyped would have been better. My point is The Weather Channel said 100 year storm when it was clear it was not. It was a bad storm, but not the end of the east coast as national TV led you to believe.

I see some very interesting and good points being made by people far smarter than I. I am learning from posts of others but I guess you would prefer, "CQ OHIO QSO PARTY" "CQ OHIO QSO PARTY" "CQ OHIO QSO PARTY" "CQ OHIO QSO PARTY"

Folks:

This is why WE need to become more educated on these storms, their dynamics, potential effects and what we should do to protect our lives and property.

TV stations today are often like the sensationalistic newspapers of the 1920s-some truth, but much sensationalism. For decades TV has often not met the definition of journalism. Radar does not lie. Usually meteorologists (as compared to weather presenters who may not have a degree) do not lie.

The weather channel was good in 1990. Today I have a hard time finding weather on that channel.

Us folks here on this web site are much smarter than the high school drop-out who believes the hyped TV reporting.

You know it when you see it....

Dan

I usually skip the TV, for my own reasons, but if you sway off of this blog and check Albany NY news, VT. News on the net ...............................Holy $^%T , the water damage is pretty bad ! I think the same goes for MA. and CT.  I just saw a few bridges out in VT. that are totally gone. Major roads too !! My penny's worth !

The long lost FOF  !  ( Hey ZE. Was with ur dad at the HP bench shoot. He puts lead down at better than 50wpm and more accurate ! He looks great ! )

Regarding the Weather Channel:

"There is no such thing as bad publicity."

Author unknown, prolly someone in mass media ownership.

Your comment defines today's media
"Cliff Mass, a climate researcher at the University of Washington and popular Seattle blogger, asks, 'When did Irene stop being a hurricane? ... there is really no reliable evidence of hurricane-force winds at any time the storm was approaching North Carolina or moving up the East Coast. ... I took a look at all the observations over Virgina, Maryland, Delaware, New Jersey, and New York. Not one National Weather Service or FAA observation location, not one buoy observations, none reach the requisite wind speed. Most were not even close. ... Surely, one of the observations upwind of landfall, over Cape Hatteras or one of the other barrier island locations, indicated hurricane-force sustained winds? Amazingly, the answer is still no.' Cliff supports his statement with data from NOAA/NWS/NDBC presented in easy to understand charts."

Of course the media hypes it up.  They're the media.  As mentioned before they will always put the worse thing damage wise on the camera.  It's comical when there's a weather anchor (ESPECIALLY from the Weather Channel) out on a beach ahead of a storm, the winds might be picking up to 30 or 40 mph gusts, and as SOON as they camera is on them, they ACT like they are being pushed back by gusts, then the rest of the report they are fine. 

I've walked out in hurricane force winds and it's not easy to stay perfectly straight but those clowns exaggerate everything.

i watched a little of the weather channel saturday, and was a little amazed at how many times they said for everyone to stay inside and not go out for any reason, then next minute they show one of their people out on the beach, and then say something that basically amounted to they know what they are doing and are safe out there ???

I was a fan of the weather channel back in the 90s when it was focused on what it advertised: weather. The first clue that they were trying to be an entertainment channel was a show called Atmospheres which dealt with their personal vacations and travels. It flopped, as have many since, no doubt.

Local coverage was pretty good down here, but they had very little about points north, which I was interested in. If nothing else, it was a good reminder of why I stopped watching TWC years ago.

Hope to get the 40m dipole back up in the air tomorrow, took it down before the storm to swap on a longer feedline.

it was overhyped only from the perspective of an after the fact viewpoint.  The hype most likely saved a lot of life.  Regardless of what that idiot George Will had to say after the fact, or that Ron Paul thinks we should just do what Galveston did in 1900 -- muddle on, after burying and burning 12000 bodies.  It's JUST a hurricane after all.

As for the TV reporters who turn nut job and hang out on the beach, eventually one of those crews is going to get swept away and that will be the end of that.

I'd rather be scared crapless and do what I need to do to stay alive, than think it was all just "hype", and end up not so well.  Day-after pontification about how the forecasters got it wrong again is just plain dumb.

(My last comment on this one!)

Dan, (and others)
                         One thing you have to keep in mind is that so many people take the hyped-up media news as gospel, be it good or bad. This causes somewhat a "mass hysteria" effect. A good example of this was that my wife was freaking out because she couldn't get any "flashlight batteries" at any of the local stores. We got into an agument when I called her an idiot for taking the local news as gospel.
We have 4 or 5 flashlights around the house, and they are all rechargeable! ! ! !
We dont have a friggin thing that even uses flashlight batteries! ! ! ! ! ! !

At least in this neck of the woods, the news media has more power over the people than the local politicians do! !  They pretty much decide the elections as well by who's advertizing they carry.

They pretty much had a feeding frenzy over the coming "storm of the century" and scared the people into hoarding every kind of survival stuff they could. The shelves in the stores were empty and the shoppers were in full feeding frenzy mode! ! ! !
They need to report the news as it happens, honestly and truthfully, short, sweet, and simple. Not embelish the stories for the highest shock and awe factors.

I was out in that mess for most of the night (on foot) (prolly why I got a cold now) and in the Baltimore area it really wasn't all that bad. Honestly, the nasty "pop-up" thunderboomers that we got last weekend were by far more violent than Irene was, and they made NO mention of them on the news.  And when they are calling for snow, you'd thing the world was coming to an end for 1 or 2" of snow! ! !

They should simply report the FACTS and allow you to make your own decisions on what to do and what not to do. If you make poor decisions, it was your choice, and you pay the price, short, sweet, and simple.

Maybe it would help restore the missing gene for common sense that is missing from the current DNA chain for modern man! ! ! ! ! !

Just my $.02 worth..................

That's it for me on this one. Over and Out ...-.-     ::)  ::)

I was wondering why the weather channel had a brief or no local forecast during the hurricane in my area.   We were on the very fringe of the rain, but the "local on the 8's" was not shown.   I turned on my computer to the NWS web site to see the radar rain coverage.    The intensity ratings for hurricanes ought to be expanded to include total destruction rather than just wind speed.    Hurricane Agnes, or whatever it was when it hit Pennsylvania, was the most destructive to ever hit the state, mostly due to the flooding from 12" of rain.   Something Vermont and other areas are finding out now.

Yeah but what really sucked was that the Mt Holly, NJ  Doppler radar site went down before the storm started tracking up the coast.  ???

From what Ive read many of the US deaths simply removed idiots from the gene pool.

Some defied evacuation orders, others got washed away on a beer run, that fool in a canoe, others on a jetty or pier, out in a sailboat, etc. And then there are the clueless that simply cant fathom the power of water and wander along in a dream state...often young and female.
No loss except maybe to relatives and friends. With the roads mostly deserted the traffic deaths otherwise would have far exceeded all of Irenes body count.

Since the dollar keeps tanking the billions keep going up but the damage is really less than say Carol/Edna in 54, Bill in 91, etc.

I have to give NYC credit for advance planning.

Carl

In PA, two deaths were caused by branches falling on campers!    Camping during a hurricane?   I cancelled my weekend camping trip.

Here's something interesting..
http://science.slashdot.org/story/11/08/29/2222252/When-Did-Irene-Stop-Being-a-Hurricane (http://science.slashdot.org/story/11/08/29/2222252/When-Did-Irene-Stop-Being-a-Hurricane)

Please do not confuse most TV "news" outlets products to anything relating to reality - especially in the area of weather reporting. You will be much better off when you realize this.

You guys in New England got off relatively easy. Yes, there are many specific cases of damage, injury and maybe even death. I'm not discounting any individual's misfortune. But in general, or over all, NE didn't get anything like what we got here in Southeast VA and NC. And that could have been pretty easily predicted before the storm. But since the major media markets are all north of here, the coverage both pre and post storm centered on NYC, Boston, Philly and DC instead of Richmond, Norfolk, VA Beach, Elizabeth City, Morehead City, and the Outer Banks in NC, etc. These areas were in the worst of the storm and this was obvious as the storm approached and even more obvious after the storm.

Please do not confuse most TV "news" outlets products to anything relating to reality - especially in the area of weather reporting. You will be much better off when you realize this.

The best one I heard was the warning about lighting your house with candles. You could have a fire. GMAFB

Steve said:
On the contrary Steve. I thought there was good coverage as the storm came ashore. As a matter of fact, Directv ran a channel specifically for Irene coverage. They started out as a broadcast from WAVY-TV 10 in Norfolk and moved up the coast as the storm advanced. It was interesting hearing and seeing all the places closed or with damage because I hadn't been there in close to 25 years!

That's good to hear. I did not catch this not having DirecTV. From my viewing of TWC, some major TV networks and a few non-local radio stations, the coverage skewed north and east from here.

Wow, that was a throwback to the old dialup bulletin board days. My other favorite one was/is DILLIGAF.

Dan

Well said.  Yes, we need to filter a lot of data that comes from the media, but I think both you and I along with many others appreciate that we have data at all.  The 1938 hurricane came to New England without much warning with around 600 people killed.  The Great Hurricane of Galveston was marked by very little warning and over 6000 people were killed.  We certainly are fortunate that we have the "talking heads" the technology, indeed, the warnings repeated until they become irritating.  We at least have the time to make intelligent, sane decisions that might save our lives and others we love.

73  Al

The AFN news channel rotates between Fox, CNN, and MSNBC and I saw that Piers Morgan on CNN devoted his show last night to defending CNN's somewhat overblown coverage.   He interviewed one of CNN's WXmen who was extremely defensive.

Fox and MSNBC had almost identical coverage.  Apparently NOTHING else happened in the rest of the world the whole weekend.  I'm betting that the 80% of the country that wasn't affected by the hurricane was pretty pissed.  At least they could have taken a break every once in a while to cover the war in Libya, or the fact that we got al-Qaiada's #2.

 The high point..if there was one, was the media reporter who was reporting on the "Sea Foam". Gave a real fine account of the stuff right down to commenting "tastes like sand" when some blew into his mouth as he stood there, totally covered with the "foam". Best part came when he found out the "foam" was raw sewage .

   I guess calling it "Sea Foam" could be considered fraud  ???

There was a bar in the Albany NY area called the above but there are many using the name across the country.

I don't know.  Say a tornado warning is issued for my home and the tornado misses by one half mile, is that over-hype?  I don't thing so.  The reason you were missed is that the Hurricane Center can't predict with 100% certainty where damage will occur.  That is why you see that "cone of uncertainty".  

Same relationship exists with normal weather forecasts.  They are "accurate" to about 85% in 36 hours then the accuracy rapidly falls off.  It is really a crap shoot to forecast more than 2 days is you want accuracy.

Interesting time lapse of Irene from Space:


http://www.weather.com/weather/videos/news-41/top-stories-169/8-days-of-irene-seen-from-space-21743#loc=41/169/21729

1. The only thing predictable about hurricanes is that they're unpredictable.

2. That "fraud" washed out several bridges in Wyoming County, PA and did a lot of damage in the Back Mountain area near Wilkes-Barre. Much of the Back Mountain is still without power (including one of my employer's transmitter sites, which has been on generator power since Sunday morning), as the storm took down several major power company feeders. A lot of trees were uprooted, as the ground was already saturated from a very wet summer.

3. As a slow moving storm with lots of rain, Irene had the potential to be another Agnes here in northeastern PA. But that potential was never realized. There was localized flooding, but not the huge flood of 1972 which put most of the Wyoming Valley under water.

4. That said, a lot of the television coverage, at least in the NYC area, was typical sleazy yellow journalism. Perhaps the worst offender was WABC-TV, which made Irene look like another Katrina. Nevertheless, many people in the metropolitan area are still without power, while areas that were not expected to be hit hard--the Catskill Mountain region of New York State and the state of Vermont--were clobbered.

5. The performance of the radio stations in this area (northeastern PA) was despicable. Only WMGS (adult contemporary) and WARM (oldies) had reports on the air about the storm and advisories from local emergency management people.  One of the local news/talk stations was off the air, the other one was running cheesy infomercials (no information about the progress of the storm or about road closures, but I could find out about quack diet "supplements" that are claimed to enlarge a certain body part) and the other music stations just played their music from either a satellite dish or an automation system, complete with canned, voicetracked jocks. EAS? That's a joke! Plenty of "flood warnings" and "high wind warnings" for individual counties, but no detailed information.

Thirteen towns in Vermont still isolated by the "fraud called Irene".

The fraud also has caused the nys thruway to be shutdown for 3 days over a 100 mile stretch. In addition, the worst flooding the mohawk river has seen since 1920 has been caused by the fraud.

I guess you missed in the title I was referring to Cape Cod
"The fraud called Irene (Cape Cod)-video"

Some of today's news from "The Register":

CAPE COD — Approximately 16,000 Cape Cod NStar customers were still without power as of 8 a.m. Tuesday, according to NStar spokesman Mike Durand.

Read more: 16,000 without power on Cape - - Wicked Local - Cape Cod http://www.wickedlocal.com/capecod/archive/x1698393819/16-000-without-power-on-Cape#ixzz1WYuWBDq6

They got major damage in Vermont, both flooding and wind damage. I'd say it's a good likelihood that Blown-Away-Bob's station might have sustained heavy damage or have been inundated. If the storm had continued straight up the coastline and not veered west, the damage in NYC and even on the Cape might have indeed been of the apocalyptic proportions hyped via the media.

No, I didn't ...but I did catch your sarcasm loud and clear. I'm glad Irene spared cape cod, but the common mantra that this storm was over-hyped depends on where you live.

It sort of depends 16,000 out of how many. Summer population is close to 500,000
In winter storms 16,000 is a tiny number. Hurricane Bob, a real hurricane was 100% without power, most 4 days or longer
Burt

The storm did not depart from the predicted path, that everyone got right

time to read that line at the bottom of your post Burt

After seeing some of your posts that belittle me albeit respectfully, for this post I say, "Any man including most in AM Forum and QRZ forum , even when they hold their tongue, says more than the typical ham operator when he speaks"

Yeah, Bob's HV PS would have been arkin' and sparkin; fer sure!  ;D  I will say that he was on fairly high ground - sort of a terrace from coming down from Mendon and going down to Rutland proper.  

My sister (84 yrs old) who lives in Rutland on the lower plain near Otter Creek was almost evac'd but at the last minute she dodged the evac bullet.  Now I don't know if I can even get over to see her this weekend.  Her daughter who lives in Wallingford can't get up the usual way as the bridge on Rte 7 is either gone on not passable.  Talked with Roger KB1CMR and Rte 4 is washed out where it connects to his road and to Rutland.  There's a 1000' section of Rte 100 in the same area that is just plain GONE!  That's the way I used to go to visit her when she lived in Bethel.

Man!  this was not so much a high wind storm as it was a high water storm.  One town,  Brandon gap, may never recover - that's near where my family came from.  It certainly has devastated Verminmont.

Al

Don’t make any sense to me, we had more red stuff on the weather radar and the storm was over head dumping rain on us for longer but on the eastern shore of Maryland not much happened, cannot understand why people further north had more damage? Although we did have a small tornado in Delaware I did not have any interruption to power or internet at home QTH. Of all the transmitter sites I have for CC radio all stayed on the air with the one combined site in Ocean City Maryland running on generator for only one hour for the whole weekend, another site I have in Whalleysville Maryland Ran off generator for eight hours but everything else ran along just fine. Being that our market (Salisbury / Ocean City Maryland) is all run from one central site and we have no news operation we simalcasted one of the local television stations continues coverage most of the day and until around eleven thirty that night. Had no STL or satellite dishes move, no cables or towers issues or any damage anywhere. My combined site in Ocean City ( http://staff.salisbury.edu/~rafantini/bviletransmitters.htm )is only about seven to ten feet above sea level and had no signs of water or flood damage beyond what we get with the average rain storm. About a third the broadcast stations in this market were off the air Saturday and I made it a big point to tell management that all our stuff kept working when the others were off the air, also noticed that we picked up a lot of hurricane related revenue Sunday and Monday.

Don’t make any sense to me, we had more red stuff on the weather radar and the storm was over head dumping rain on us for longer but on the eastern shore of Maryland not much happened, cannot understand why people further north had more damage?

It's due to the more mountainous terrain and the drainage of the rain causing more flooding.

Absolutely.  Some of those mountain sides have VERY steep inclines.  I witnessed an "ice out" one time to a small stream - it was frightening!  This HUGE wall of water came cascading down the hillside.  Imagine what 8" of rain would do to these small streams.  Many of the roads in Verminmont were built snaking around the banks of these small stream.  When they get this much rain they just erode the very base of the roads and POOF the road is gone.  That's what happened to the 1000' section of Rt 100.

Vt is a pretty state to visit but much of the roads are still pretty much paved over wagon trails that have been beefed up and fixed over the decades with a better base - then comes along this much rain and yet another section of the road is washed away.  This storm was simply too much for many of these streams / roads to handle

Al

VT is rock. The eastern shore of MD is sand. You can figure out the rest.

I think what Al is trying to say is that those mountains are so steep that it can rain on both sides of the same acre!  :)

   Frightening  indeed . I would love to have seen that...from a less than frightening vantage point. As a great philosopher opined "Nature does nothing in vain." Not always pleasant but so often awesome to behold. Hopefully the human side will fare better than hoped. Never disappointed here when the death and destruction is far less than predicted.

I wonder what that stream along RT9 did. It was a beautiful ride to Horsetraders.

Fraud or not, and maybe more hype, but I heard a news report this morning that this one will rank in the top ten most expensive (in terms of monetary damage) in the history of the US.

Looks like that one in the Gulf is headed right this way.  We might get some much-needed rain from it, but I'm not going to bother to take any antennas down.

Thanks Burt, I need that!

Here's a map showing the status of VT roads.  There is a lot of improvement since yesterday.  Note that Rt 9 has still limited access.

http://crisislanding.appspot.com/?crisis=2011_flooding_vermont

Al

Not quite sure what you mean, Steve, but VT is far from rock.  There is a lot of soft, rich soil which really saturates with water under heavy rain.  A significant part of the damage was the sheer volume of water that had swollen the normally tranquil streams.  For example, Route 4 is a prime illustration of the wagon trail along the stream road.  As far as I can remember as a Vermonter this road was prone to washout during spring meltoff.  It was this road that was really hit hard with washout during this terrible storm.  There were a lot of bridges that were ruined not only from the erosive effect of the raging current but the large number of houses and debris that flowed down the swollen streams.  

I come from Clarendon, a small town south of Rutland.  The Otter Creek is a fairly tranquil creek until there is either snow melt and or really heavy rain. It then easily overflows its banks and floods the farmland just east of the house I used to live in.  I could see this annual flooding from my bedroom window as a teen. This time the road west of Otter creek was completely inundated to the point that a relatively high ground section of Campbell drive was totally cut off by water.  That has never happened.   I asked my sister who is just shy of 10 years older than me and neither one of us can remember anything even close to this flooding - she is 84. An example of this unprecidented damage was route 4 going over Killington.  Neither one of can remember anything remotely close to this happening. This was just completely overwhelming.

73, Al

That's too bad Al. The state did a lot of work on RT 9 during the years I traveled it. Many times I thought of pulling over to hang out at the stream but usually in a hurry to buy good stuff.

Power restored last night, according to CL&Ps web site 46% of the town is still out. We were one of the lucky ones

Still no phone, limited cable.

Been clearing the yard of large limbs all morning. 

Appreciate all the effort by local and out of town utility crews. It is a thankless job and I hope they get home saeflyt to their families soon.

Glad you are finally back on the grid Carl. Killingworth was totally dark for a long time. My mother, who lives in nearby Clinton on Shore Road, is still without power, as is roughly 30% of that town. Unfortunately, the sump pump I installed in her basement doesn't work without electricity, so she has a foot of water in her basement. Looks like some work on the furnace is going to be required (again). Ah well, I am grateful that she's fine and handling it all with her usual good sense of humor.

Welcome back to the civilized grid!

Rob W1AEX

All

Someone flew over area to photograph the devastation

http://wingsovermont.com/

Note row 6 down either picture - the church steeple. I used to go there as a pre-teen.  Look carefully at the right picture - the small road going off the the right.  That's the road I used to live on.  The house was a 3 storey very old house.  I'm afraid to even think of what happened to it.  I'm 74 years old - NOTHING has ever happened to that area like this during my lifetime.  This is, in my opinion a 100 year storm.  Maybe even worse.

Re: the pictures of Wheelerville road. That's the road that Roger KB1CMR lives on.  Thank goodness he had the good sense to get out of there.  My guess is he's staying at his girlfriend's home.  Hope his house is OK

Al

Rob,
Sri abt the mother in law. Had 5 ft of water on the old house during the flood of 82 in the lower valley shore. No fun at all. I was down in Clinton doing some food shopping and the tree damage is pretty intense. There was a guy in the parking lot of the local Stop and Shop selling small boxed generators- $3,500!!!
The XYL used the experience to clean out and completely clean the refrigerator so some good came from it.

Al,
Those photos are unreal. I had no idea of the extent of damage in VT. They tell the story

Carl
/KPD

Carl: more pictures. Check out the waterfalls coming down the stairs!

http://www.buzzfeed.com/mjs538/incredible-pictures-of-irenes-destruction-in-verm

Al

Al,
That really shows it. That stair one is pretty amazing
Look at these that show pretty severe destruction all along the coast http://www.buzzfeed.com/mjs538/frightening-hurricane-irene-destruction-photos (http://www.buzzfeed.com/mjs538/frightening-hurricane-irene-destruction-photos)
Carl
/KPD

Al..

1927 was the big one in Vermont.

Of course there were many fewer roads... but they were all 'dirt' to begin with!


Irene was 'under-hyped' for vermont.

The Governor of the State downplayed the storm for a couple days afterwards.
Said " there are no towns that are completely cut-off..."

He also said his sources told him the towns with the most rainfall only got "4 or 5 inches at most"

We got 7.65 here, and a friend of mine down the state a bit got 11"!

No wind to speak of because, of course, we were on the west side of the storm.


We were without power for 4 days... but so what?
I have propane stove/ and water heater..

Generator to get water and keep the food cold.. Only ran it 4 hours a day.


All ready for the next one!

My avatar shows me standing by listening for the latest reports during the 27 storm. I was much younger then