The AM Forum

Just got back from Dayton about an hour ago.   Random observations merely my opinions etc. feel free to disagree...Friday morning was the best.  Got in to flea mkt. at 8 am.   Some good things but you had to have $$$ and be fast i.e. not willing to wait around and see if prices come down.  Globe King 500, National rx 300, 303, HQ 170 and 180, Rangers, Pacemaker, Vikings, a Gonset HF tx and companion amp, big B&W tx, Lots of Collins mil surplus rx and ham band rx and tx from the black wrinkle box days, a really nice DX100 at the Harbaugh tent...prices seemed pretty high and sellers all seemed to be organized against bargaining--I bought a few minor things--bird wattmeter, small AF tube amp, AF sig. gen. and a Unique Wire Tuner and I'd make offers and get told the price is the price (but they'd eventually knock off 10%).  This happened so much I figured there was some sort of pact made on Thursday night but who knows.  Most of the boatanchor gear I saw looked pretty clean and cared for.  There were around 6 KW matchboxes for $300-$350 and a lot of 250 w. ones for around $100-$150.   Someone had a good looking "used for 3 months" AL1500 for $1700 which was one of the better deals out there if you want an 8877 amp assuming it works okay.  Lots of high power components--big roller inductors, vac. variables etc.  there were one or two nice looking five or six foot racks for around  $60.

By around mid-day Friday, most anything good was taken.  MFJ sold out on their balanced feedline RF amp meters surprisingly.  The Wireman is selling 600 ohm ladder line spacers, 50 for $20; Ten Tec has a new L network tuner with a better meter and a larger air variable cap but for yikes, $900.

Saturday stank.  The wx wasn't very good--cloudy and raining off and on in the morning, and the foot traffic was light.  So many flea market sellers took off that there were big holes out in the flea market which made Hamvention look more like an average hamfest at noon on Sunday.  Most of what was there was junk.  If I had worked on Friday and not shown up until Saturday morning, I would have been very disappointed.

73

Rob K5UJ


I'm sorry I can't be more specific; I wish I'd taken notes but maybe others can fill in details with more brain cells active.

Thanks for the report.  Makes me feel better about not being able to make this one.
 ;D

I've never heard anything positive about dayton. Since about 1990 its always been sucky, so the reports say.

I'll be curious to get a report from K4KYV.

Don't read too much into what I wrote--it's still worth going to in my opinion as long as you are there for the first day.  I did get some good deals, but I didn't score anything major because I wasn't there for that.  While there were no atomic piles, i.e. no 3cx3000 amps, no old 1 Kw input AM rigs; anything like that, there was a lot for an AMer if he wanted a tx that would do a 100 to 200 w. carrier, plus nice to have stuff like high Z mics, AF signal generators (I picked up one of those) and a few moderately reasonable tube AF amps.  I bought an old tube 12 w. heathkit AF amp with a 6 microvolt input that I'm gg to try using to amp up the  product detector output of my yaesu rx to drive a speaker, or use with a turntable to play records.  We swept it Sat. night with the sig. generator and it sounded real clean. 

These are some of the things I bought that I probably would not purchase on eBay but when I can walk around, pick something up and look at it, talk to the seller, and make a deal, hand over the cash and carry, I'll do it.  Once I'm there, I'd much rather buy old gear that way than on-line.

I didn't go this year. I heard there was little or no rain, so that's a plus. For the AMer, I've found the NEAR Fest to be far superior to Dayton in quantity and quality. And there's far less crap to look through and far less ground to cover. Throw in the fact that it's less hassle to get in and out of the fest, and a much more friendly operation, and Dayton seems less and less worth attending. YMMV.

For you Easties!

I haven't been to Dayton since the early 1980s.

The flea market was sparse but I thought the quality of stuff had improved over previous years.  I didn't see too much of the junked computer stuff, industrial surplus items like hydraulic pumps, etc, and not a lot of the typical non-radio "craft" rubbish.  There seemed to be more AM rigs of various sorts than SSB transceivers, but not many tubes, transformers or air variables.

I didn't pick up a lot of stuff this year, but my biggest haul was when I first entered the gate.  A guy had a couple of boxes full of books and I looked through one of them and found a couple of Jones Radio handbooks and a 1930 ARRL handbook.  I asked the guy what he wanted for them, and he said $1 apiece.  Then asked me if I wanted to buy both boxes for $5 each.  They were full of vintage books and magazines, such as 1930's era Radio Craft and Radio News.  Within 10 minutes after the flea market had opened at 8:00, I was walking out the gate with the load.

John, KN4ME picked up a working BC-348 for $20 from the same guy.

The vendor said all this stuff was from an estate and all he wanted to do was get rid of it.  He obviously didn't know he had a gold mine of collectors' items that could have fetched many times what he was asking.

The reason I didn't buy much more at the flea market was that most of what I saw that I would have gone ape over a few years ago, I already have 1, 2 or 3 copies of now, and don't need another.

Due to the rain Saturday, I spent more time than usual indoors, and attended 3 forums.  Bob Heil's forum on audio quality was filled standing room only.  He made some interesting observations in his talk. It was oriented primarily towards SSB, but most of his observations about typical ham audio were spot on.  The FCC forum featured Laura Smith, Riley's replacement.  Although people were standing at the back, there were plenty of empty seats towards the front.  I won't go into details, since her whole speech will undoubtedly be dissected on numerous other amateur radio sites. I attended part of the Collins forum, but the speaker was going into minutia of restoring a 32S series transmitter, and I left before it was over. The room was about 60% filled for that one.

Come to NEAR Fest. You won't be disappointed!

I've heard the the fest in Orlando (?) Hamcation or something like that is also good.  lots of sunbelt retirees hauling out their old rigs to sell.  I guess the biggest big AM rig I saw was the globe king.  There were some Drakes, later JA rigs and a few Ten Tecs; I just didn't mention them because I figured no one here would care that much. 

Don, I saw you in the back at the Collins thing & was gg to go introduce myself but when I looked around later you had already taken off.  Maybe next year.

We did Hamcation about 5 years ago. Stayed with relatives, borrowed their car, went to Universal Studios, did the Mardi Gras, saw Joan Jet.  Had a total blast.  I think we did the Florida State Fair the same trip.  Only PITA was bringing stuff home on the plane.  I bought a huge suitcase at the hamfest for $10 to carry it all in.

well the md FM fester at Howard CO. fairgrounds ( maryland) will be on teh 25th. Thats my next stop.

I had to work until noon on Friday and couldn't get out there until after closing on Friday. So I went Sat. and the intermittent showers were there as predicted  ::)
Used an umbrella for the first one, went to lunch for the second, drove down to Mendelson's for the third (I used to spend a lot of rainy Saturdays on the 3rd floor when I lived in Dayton '92-'96), and the fourth and worst hit around 3:30 PM so I went to all the indoor exhibit halls then.

During the periods of non-rain I browsed the flea market and there were a few interesting things but many were wildly overpriced IMHO. But near the front, there was a trailerload of military surplus stuff being sold by the pound ($1/lb) so I took a chance on a dirty but complete Tek 453 scope for $25.

Down at Mendelson's warehouse there was an HP 124 display unit with an 8577A(?) 0.01-350 MHz spectrum analyzer plugin in the compartment. Had a trace with a zero-Hz "bump" so it's not completely dead, anyway. I asked the price and was told at the counter "it's an old scope, $75" so I paid and ran before someone figured out it was worth quite a bit more than that. Had to leave my stuff with friends in Xenia since I have to fly home from where I'm working in two weeks  :'(

I also stopped by the "DX-60 AM tent" and left my autograph on their sign. I saw a number of familiar callsigns from AMfone there, but no "live" members  ;D

Naturally by 6 PM Saturday it was perfectly clear and sunny. I met up with a couple of guys from the "72 Chew" (7.272) net and we hung out at Fricker's on the new "Restaurant Row" north of town. Lots of other hams in there. Sunday was 50 degrees and clear but I didn't go back for dumpster-diving with the 6.5 hour drive pending.

Not sure what the official attendance figures are but I would be surprised if it broke 20,000. I have only missed a few years since 1992 and it was closer to 40,000 then. As pointed out, lots of empty spaces in the flea market even at 8 AM Saturday. It has been far more exciting in past years...

just my .02 worth
-Charles
WB3JOK

On the pricey stuff, and sellers not wanting to haggle, did they leave with the gear they brough as usual in that situation, or did people pay the higher prices?

If you missed Friday, Saturday would not even have been worth driving 100 miles if you were mainly interested in the flea market.  Most of the good stuff went in a hurry.  That's why I missed 4 years in a row; a work conflict prevented me from arriving until Saturday, so I stayed home.

If attendance stays down, I wish they would go back to just having it on Saturday and Sunday, and opening it at 6 AM like they used to.  And they could reduce the size of the flea market area so there wouldn't be so many empty spaces, and convert the rest back to general parking for those wanting to get close to the flea market.  As it is, many people rent a vendor space just so they can park inside and not have to haul heavy stuff 1/2 mile back to the vehicle.

I don't go for "bargains" any more.  Just for hard-to-find items I haven't been able to locate, and usually prepared to pay a premium price.

The unexpected bargain of books & mags included an assortment of 1930's Radio News and Radio Craft.  Some interesting reading, but the mags are mostly oriented towards broadcast listening, not amateur radio.

I added a new ARRL handbook (1934), a new Radio handbook (7th edition), and some dupes of ones already in my collection, but in much better condition than my originals.

I'm still here at my hotel. Will be leaving Monday morning for the drive back to NJ. As a vendor, I got to tour the vendor setups on Thursday. Saw lots and lots of boatanchors and lots changing hands on that day. Friday was definitely the busier of the 3 three days with great weather throughout the day. Several times around my spaces, it was so busy, I kept losing tract who I was talking to. With the several rain downpours on Saturday, and the periodic spitting of rain throughout the day, table action was way down. Plus, I lost several early hours on Saturday morning, since I'm supporting several inside vendors with products. Of course, around 6PM Saturday, the weather turned beautiful. Sunday's weather was also great and a number of vendors hung around that normally would have been gone, but good customer traffic was light except to the typical bottom feeder types. I bought nothing, but several people came by with free bags of manuals for my collection.

Smae story here, Bill.

I LIVE in Ohio and haven't been there since '87.
I got my fill of it when I worked in the "industry". Was there every year, from start to finish, 1975 to 1986.

 

I'd say it might have been a little of both.  I was really tempted to buy one of the Kw Matchboxes, not because I need one but because I always wanted one, but I ran out of cash first.  Don is right on about the changes if attendance stays low.  I was really hoping this would be a better year with gas less than last year, and what I had heard about hams leaving eBay for hamfests.  The guys I was with all decided to only come for one day next year and either leave on Saturday or go do something else like go to the air force museum.  My next hamfest (not really a hamfest though) will probably be the Midwest Classic Radio Hamboree in Elburn IL.  One of the Dishtronix guys, the ones who make the $10K s.s. amp told me they've sold 9 of them so far.  Takes them a month to build one.  This is probably the only commercial s.s. amp that can handle 375 w. AM for any length of time.   Found out Ameritron sells their 50 v. amp p.s. separately for anyone who wants to hb a s.s. amp but is having difficulty building the p.s.  Palstar was there with their new version of Pat Stein's Command amps.  Redesigned front panel to make it look like all the other Palstar stuff but the inside looked the same (fortunately).   They told me they still make the export amp, which to me is probably the only commercially made amp now, that is good for high power buzzard AM, but they don't list it on their website because they won't ship it to U.S. addresses.  Still has the 80 lb. B+ transformer etc. but costs somewhere between $6K and $7K.  I didn't pay close attention because I know I'll have to make one rather than buy theirs, or get a high level modulated tx.

I thought it was a pretty fair event, left Saturday afternoon with only $1 in my pocket.

The highlight for me was seeing the 10KW Omnitronix solid-state AM transmitter.  I was at the 1990 NAB show when they introduced their 1 KW transmitter.  Fairly low-cost, unsophisticated rig.  The one at the show was incomplete.  Sitting on top of the cabinet was a pile of Kahn AM Stereo stuff.  Some decent QRO coulda been yours for $3500.

I had a good talk with Greg K9QI.  He's designed some boards for running Compatible SSB, which folds all the sideband energy of your AM signal onto one side of the carrier, but is still detectable with an envelope detector with no distortion.  If you guys hear him on the air, ask him about it.

73 Dave

  I was there for all three days. Like others have said, Friday beautiful, Saturday a little rainy and Sunday cold but clear.
  There were more boatanchors there than I remember seeing in other years. Missed seeing some of my friends who decided not to attend this year. (Pete, you were busy every time I was over by your space!) Prices did seem a bit high, probably the e-pay effect. Less computer junk and craft stuff. For a good shopping time, Friday was the day to be there. A lot of vendors pulled out before the Saturday rain, Sunday was like a ghost town in the flea market. I did meet a number of the vendors who were staying at the KOA.
  On Friday and Saturday I was wearing a hat that says " I transmit... therefore AM". I had a lot of folks who commented on how much they liked the hat. NO negative comments from anyone. I spent my time walking slow and discovered a lot of folks with modern rigs who have just recently discovered the AM function on their radio and have started using AM and like it!
  Is Dayton what it used to be? No, but with most of the "old guard" hamfests dying, what is?. (The exception to this is NEAR Fest) Is it still fun to go? Yes. Will I go again? Already made my reservation for the KOA.

Bill
  

Well, after reading some of the negative comments...I wondered if we went to the same place!  We had a great time.  Of course, Friday was the best day...WX was beautiful...it was actually a little hot.  A real highlight for me was having the opportunity to meet Robert, W0VMC in person for the first time.  Also saw several other AM pals gathered at the DX-60 Net tables and generally really enjoyed ourselves.  We had a really wonderful dinner with several AMers Friday night at Troy, OH. ...really nice little town with a very nice Italian restaurant.

Sat. was another story for the WX, but we managed to see quite a bit between the rain showers.  The flea market was definitely down in size, but there seemed to be a lot of good boatanchor stuff...prices were all over the map.

Another fun experience at Dayton...there for my 41st year.

73,  Jack, W9GT

Sons Rick, W8KHK, and Bill, W2WM, and I were at Dayton Friday and Saturday. A lot of good stuff followed them home, but the only thing that followed me was an iMicro Webcam that I just now discovered needs an amcap.exe to make it play. Where o where can one find this file? Duh!

For me there were two highlights at Dayton:

1) Meeting Don at Marion's Piazza Saturday night. We arrived there about 5pm for beers and a little rest. Several other hams showed up around 6:45, including Butch, K0BS. Then later a bunch from the Collins Classic showed up. Good time! However, I wanted to kill myself when after we departed Marion's on discovering that we forgot to get a picture of us with Don--Damn!

2) Meeting with Dick Ross, K2MGA, owner of CQ Communications, and his Managing Editor, Gail Sheehan, K2RED. CQ is presently preparing my book Reflections 3 for publication, which wil be released around the end of Summer.

'til next year then, and Don, hope you're there again so I can correct the error in not getting a picture with you this time.

Walt, W2DU

John KN4ME, Gary K4XK and I went to what we thought was that restaurant Friday night, but saw no other AM'ers there.  Not sure of the name of the restaurant, but it was on the corner near the main drag.  The food was  exceptional, and I have decided that if I am ever in the vicinity again, I'll make a special trip over to Troy just to find that restaurant again.  Next year's Dayton, for sure.

Maybe we got there too early (about 6 PM).  We stayed overnight at Gary's house in Shinbone OH, which is about 50 mi. north of the hamfest site, so we finished the meal and headed north.

I usually prefer to eat at 7-8 PM, but we didn't want to kill that much time around Dayton after the hamfest.

None of our crew particularly likes the food at Marion's, so we had dinner at another restaurant before arriving there Saturday night.  That took care of the time-killing chore between the flea market and 7 PM. I just sipped on white wine at Marion's (they chill their red wine, which sucks).

One thing I did notice this year was that the crowd at Dayton seemed to be in better physical condition than in the past.

My wife came with me one year, back in the 80's, and remarked that she had never before seen so many big arses, big guts and neurotic faces crammed together in one place in her entire life.  It has long been an ongoing joke about the body size and lack of hygiene amongst the attendees.

This year I saw less of that.  Not so many morbidly obese people; only one or two had food stains all over the front of their shirt, and I don't remember encountering anyone who smelt particularly bad, even while everyone was huddled inside during rainy periods on Saturday.

And fewer of those notorious Daytonmobiles - you know, the electric scooters with aggressive drivers who plough their way through the crowd, running over other peoples' feet and colliding with their ankles, with scornful expressions on their face because you didn't get out of their way fast enough.

 " My wife came with me one year, back in the 80's, and remarked that she had never before seen so many big arses, big guts and neurotic faces crammed together in one place in her entire life.  It has long been an ongoing joke about the body size and lack of hygiene amongst the attendees. "

Its just natrul selection... 

Fat+booze+tobacco+inactivity

klc

That's because they all died.

I thought it was interesting that some of the boatanchors were not moving even after being marked down in price over the weekend.  I came away with a couple of good deals.

Although attendance seemed like it was down over last year, during the awards on Sunday the organizers said that their indications were that the final numbers may actually be up.

I thought that the talk by Richard Garriott, W5KWQ who operated from the ISS was great.  His father also operated from space.

I also went to the FCC forum and I thought it was simply a repeat of previous years, i.e. short duration, packed house, prepared speeches, couple of jokes thrown in, little time for questions at the very end and the questions that were asked were generally blown off.  I came away with the impression that Ms Laura either has a very quirky sense of humor or doesn't really care for hams in general - hard to tell but I'll give her the benefit of the doubt.


Hamvention 2009 video (and others) from K0NEB: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d8AiPHsd6xc (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d8AiPHsd6xc)

W5KWQ: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tg6TRbtlrhE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tg6TRbtlrhE)

That's the way the FCC forums have always been.  If you thought the questions were blown off at this one, you ought to have attended the ones when Johnny Johnston was the speaker/moderator, particularly when questions were asked about Docket 20777 and  a few years later, the pending AM power issue. 

Actually, the house wasn't packed for the FCC forum.  There were plenty of vacant seats in the front rows, but people coming in at the last minute couldn't see them from rear entrance.  I think curiosity about Laura attracted a lot of people. The  house was packed for Bob Heil's forum on voice quality.

As for the  hamfest, if attendance was up, it certainly didn't  look that way at the flea market.  Many spaces were vacant, and some of the hamfest people said there were a lot of no-shows this year.  You could easily walk up and down the lanes between the vendor rows, and actually see the merchandise through the crowd of people.  I have seen years when every space was filled, you had to elbow your way down the rows, and it took an effort to see anything.  The indoor area was easily navigable, even when the rain started and people vacated the flea market.

Even though the quantity was down, I thought there was more good stuff and less junk at the flea market this year.  My biggest disappointment was the lack of an AM forum, and I never got to meet up with some of the people who I know attended the hamfest.  John, KN4ME was very disappointed that he was never able to connect with Robert, W0VMC.

Hmmm, I was in the second row on the right-hand side of center, there were very few empty seats around me and when I checked people were standing at the back and in the doorway.  Maybe I was at a different FCC Forum?  :-)   Regardless, my point was as usual there were many people there and not much to be heard .

I did see you Don but you were busy chatting with a vendor about getting Heil mic and IHY box for your rice box.  ;-)

I forgot to mention this earlier but one of the coolest things I saw in the flea market was a rare and in very good condx Lakeshore Industries Bandhopper VFO.   First time I ever saw one. 

Rob / K5UJ

As far as rare equipment sights, I spotted a good condition Johnson 6N2 Thunderbolt, Sonar CFC VFO/exciter, Gross CW-25 and CW-50 RF sections, Li'l Lulu transmitter, Gonset 500W linear amplifier, and 2 beautiful all chrome case Utica 650's and matching chrome VFO's. Actually, one of the 650's was the one I sold the seller several years ago. He was now moving to a retirement village and needed to downsize his equipment. I also remember seeing some Eldico items but don't remember what they were. I also remember seeing one vendor with several vintage General Radio test equipment in those beautiful wood cabinets. Based on the quickness that they were sold, I guess even I had some sought after equipment.

I saw a General Electric sideband slicer.  Apparently a commercially built version of the one described in a 50's or 60's G-E Ham News. It had 4 positions: USB, LSB, "carrier lock" and normal AM.  If it is the same circuit, USB/LSB use the phasing method of sideband selection. The carrier lock mode uses the same product detector with a PLL designed to lock the BFO onto the AM carrier - a synchronous detector, while the normal AM is a diode detector.

I would have bought it but he was asking way too much - for that kind of money it would be better to throw in some more bux and purchase a Sherwood sync detector.  He said I was the only person all day who had asked anything about it.  In retrospect I should have made him a more reasonable offer and he might have taken it.

You saw a Lil' LuLu?  wow, I missed that one.  I remember seeing the Gonset HF amp.  I missed the other things you saw.  I might be selling some things next year though, and then perhaps I'll get to see more.

I had an experience a bit like that with a guy who may not have even been a ham, who was selling a stack of audio gear.  he had a couple of FM Optimods and an Orban paragraph eq.  I asked him why he wasn't selling AM Optimods at a hamfest and if anyone had expressed any interest in the paragraph eq.  (the rest of his stuff was so so.)   He said something like I was the only one who had even recognized the Orban eq. and he was hoping some broadcasters who were hams would buy the Optimods.  I wished him good luck but the joke was on me when I stopped by the next day and the Optimods were sold.  Turned out there were a couple of guys from radio stations there and they bought them.

That would be the YRS-1.  Very rare.  I have one and know of only one other - in the Pavek Wireless Museum in Minneapolis.  After a few slight mods it does very well.  Not quite as fast a lock as the Sherwood, and the audio not as wide, but has the advantage of selectable sideband or, if you replace the 6C4 audio pre with a 6J6 and do a few slight wiring mods, you can do "stereo" - USB in the left speaker, LSB in the right.

Gonset 500W linear = GSB-101? Just curious.

There was the Gonset 500W (1954-1955), Po 250 W PEP, and there was the Gonset GSB-101 (1958-1961), Po 800 W PEP.

Best news I've had all week Walt!
I'm glad that got into production, was waiting on WorldRadio, but see the CQ fellows moved it along!
I look forward to it later this year, should make some good reading on the cold Maine fall nights.

Now if they could only bring "Kurt Sterba" and "Lil Paddle" back, they made me laugh like no others.


73 my friend,
Bruce W1UJR

I nearly fell out of my chair, Bruce, when Dick Ross instantly said 'yes' when I asked him in February if he'd be interested in publishing the 3rd edition.

Worldradio sat on it for a long time, due to being shorthanded in the editorial dept. So about a year ago I approached the ARRL, and they said sure, but a short time later they withdrew the offer, saying it wasn't likely to sell well. Apparently they didn't know that 1st and 2nd edition-copies were going for between $300 and $500 on eBay and Alibris Books.

Anyway, one day in early February I was looking through my library and saw a book that I hadn't noticed for quite some time--a book on antennas written by my close friend Bob Haviland, W4MB, in Daytona Beach. What I found was so surprising is that it was published by CQ. I had totally forgotten that CQ published books, so I called Dick Ross, and he said he'd be proud to have Reflections in his library of CQ published books. So there you have it. And I'm pleased that you have an interest in it. I'll announce it on AMfone, and also on my web page when it's released.

Concerning Kurt Sterba and 'Lil Paddle, I haven't yet seen the 'on line' verson of Worldradio, so I don't know whether that pair are still there or not.

Walt, W2DU

It just occurred to me I didn't see the dude wearing the hard hat with the miniature tower and yagi beam mounted on top, at Dayton this year.

Maybe he got tired of people rolling their eyes and sniggering behind his back.

But I could have just missed him.  I stayed out in the flea market most of the time, and I only recall seeing him in the indoor area.

He's one of the (DARA) organizers of the event and he was there with hat and tower Don.

Speaking of which, has anyone actually seen the ham who drives this car? It was in the Salem Mall parking area as usual... (is it one of the AMfoners)?  ;D

(http://i43.tinypic.com/2hfudmc.jpg)

No, Ham Sexy for sure.

Nah.  No AMfoner would have ever parked in the Salem Mall and have had to take the shuttle bus to lug the rupture sets from the flea market to the car.

Looks more like HamSexy to me.

You have to get up around 4, get to Waffle House by 5, then get to Hara Arena around 6 in order to get a good parking space.  Two years ago we did that and had to park on the grass because the car dealer was still in business.  This time we were almost at the traffic light in the $10 ex-car dealer parking lot.  I missed the guy with the hard hat/tower too.

That's exactly what I have done in past years.  Even 6 AM is probably too late. I wouldn't waste time with breakfast, but would go right to the hamfest site, just stopping for take-away coffee and pastry along the way.  I have arrived as  late as 5:30 AM and been able to park on the street, right outside the gate at the rear entrance to the flea market (Baysore Rd?).  Sometimes the gate Nazis wouldn't let me inside the flea market before opening time, but other times I walked right in and no-one stopped me.  A few times I was able to grab another hour of sleep in the car when I couldn't get in immediately.  Other years I have paid to park in the mud field across the  road - beats taking the shuttle bus to the mall.  This year I was with someone who had a parking permit for the paved area just outside the Pub.

A trick that has worked more than once when I didn't have a fleamarket ticket or any ticket at all, was to have a friend who had rented a space pass me his ticket through the fence, use it to get past the gate, and then return the borrowed ticket to its owner.  That got me inside the flea market area until it was open to the general public or until I could purchase a ticket.  I have picked up some nice goodies that I would have otherwise missed, that way.

I notice that for the past two years the security guards have been a lot less rude than before (I missed 3 years in a row because of my daughter's graduation followed by a work conflict for a couple of years).  Before my hiatus, the guards all seemed to have an attitude problem and would go out of their way to hassle you any way they could. I think that rudeness drove a  lot of people away, so apparently the hamfest people finally caught on to reality and switched to a different security company.

Right--we got away with being about 30 minutes later than usual because of the lower turnout. But I'd have to eat something more than a doughnut in order to have enough energy to make it through the flea market and lug things back to the truck.  One of the guys I go there with has done that sharing of the flea market ticket before too.  I never knew about the flea market rear entrance parking--I'll have to keep that in mind, thanks.  I think for anything really big or heavy they'll let you drive in and get it, but then you loose your space.  Next year I may buy a flea market space to sell some things and partly to solve the parking problem

73

rob / k5uj

For years people have been known to buy a flea market space but use it only for parking inside the area.  Some time ago the hamfest people have said they were cracking down on unattended spaces, but as sparse as things were this year, I don't think it would be cause for a problem.

Some people have got creative by bringing a bunch of marginal junk they wouldn't really care if it got ripped off, placing it on a table or open trunk of the car, and selling using the "Honor System".  Place some blank envelopes on a clip board with a pen  chained to it, with instructions to put the money in the envelope, seal it, write a list of the item(s) purchased on the outside of the envelope, and drop it through the slot where the car window on the driver side is slightly cracked.

I have never tried to rent a space to sell stuff even though I have enough that I need to get rid of to fill two or three spaces. I never wanted to be tied down minding the store, missing all the goodies other people have for sale.

It's really very difficult to keep track of sold vendor space as "real" vendors, part-time vendors, or just parked space for a vehicle. Vendors buy the space for three days. They can come in for all 3 or only come in for one or two. So a space could be vacant on Friday and be occupied on Saturday or vice versa. Likewise, single person vendors break to wander, go to forums, hit the john or food tent. Bringing a few items to sell, even for an hour or two, can help supplement any outward expenses or purchases and "verifies" you're truly a vendor even if DARA people chose to wander and try to identify non vendor parking in the flea market area. If you're a boatanchor enthusiast, searching for great ones to bring home, buying a 100 pound rig and then trying to cart it on the shuttle or back to some muddy parking area far away, doesn't sound like great planning.

Thoroughly enjoyed the fest this year, travelling with brother Bill, W2WM, and Dad, Walt, W2DU.  My first visit to the Hamvention was in 2006, and this was my second.  Spent most of our time in the flea area, even braved the periodic rain showers on Saturday.  Got many items at a bargain price, the only concern was fitting everything in the car for the trip back to Marietta.

The surprise purchase was a DDS VFO kit from Jim Hagerty, WA1FFL.  Very impressive product, clean design, lots of features, immaculate output spectrum.

Had a nice eyeball QSO with Don, K4KYV at Marion's Saturday evening.

I have not personally seen the Tower-Beam Helmet, but brother Bill, W2WM, found this pic he took when in Dayton in 2001.  If you zoom in, you can see it is Andrew, N8VES, from Dayton.

I'd bet he has a sore neck at the end of the day.

Regarding the vendors, a legitimate seller could unload all his merchandise the first few hours of the first day, but still has a paid slot for all three.

I would probably just park in the spot for the first day and check out the rest of the vendors.  Then after everybody else's stuff has been picked over, and my feet are dead tired, open up shop as the new kid on the block.