The AM Forum

Hello All Again,

 In my new home, I am cleaning/clearing out the basement room for painting, as it is transformed into the radio room. I spent last night cleaning up the telephone wiring (old junk, like Bakelite arrestor blocks without arrestors, loose and poorly executed splices, unused phone lines, tacking down the new cable and fiber for the FIOS box).

Besides making the room habitable and dry, raising everything off of the floor in case of flooding, what should I consider as I transform this room into the shack and shop? Grounding? Cable Feeds?


David Goncalves
W1EUJ

After turning 40 YRS old,  "Light" becomes very important. A few 60W floods on a variack work out nice while operating, Its the other times when it comes in handy...  I've got dual florescents over the workbench ( one hidden under it for when the stuff drops) over the operating position, and much of the area basement walls are painted white. The light on two seperate ckts for when the breaker trips is cool. A dehumidifier in the shack is cool. Microwave, p-olean jug or toylet, and a small refrigerator. bed is nice.... My wife is looking for a home with a barn to put my junk in, also, she said, so I have a place to live....   klc

>The light on two seperate ckts for when the breaker trips is cool.

Ooh! That is a good idea!

> A dehumidifier in the shack is cool.

Check! To keep the restored rigs from rusting again.

>p-olean jug or toylet, and a small refrigerator. bed is nice....

Ick to the jug, but I am glad that a working bathroom is located down the hall in the basement.


Thanks for the suggestions, keep them coming.


David Goncalves

Overhead plumbing, as W1KRW's recent adventure brought to light. I had the same thing happen with my basement workbench being located under one of the cast iron drain pipes. Fortunately it was an emptying bathtub and not something worse that blew out one of a previously plugged up outlet on top. It was still a huge mess, especially the small parts drawers.

Other considerations like washer/dryer if they reside in the basement, furnace, etc come into play. And this time of year, critters coming in from the cold through gaps you didn't know existed.

Tapped keg at all times. Must have tapped keg

>Tapped keg at all times. Must have tapped keg

Half-keg, half-fridge - kegerator!

Hi Dave,

Having spent the better part of the last two years designing, and redesigning my new barn/hamshack/studio, I found the following helpful.

1) Power - Plan on 120 VAC/20 amp service on several outlets, also at least two to three 230VAC plugs as well. You can never have too many outlets. Make some switched via wall switches. Emergency Power Kill, clearly marked, is important.

2) No florescent lights, they make noise, incandescent all the way. Target or spot lighting is ideal, esp when it can be independently switched to illuminate a bench or part of the room as designed. In lighting, more is always better, and you can never have too much.

3) Wall finish, we figured out that fancy plywood, stained to match the trim, was the best method for wall treatment behind the operating stations. You can drill holes in it without worry, replacement is simple, and its so much more robust than sheet-rock. Our design calls for fastening it to the wall with drywall screws, so it can be really removed for access to wiring, or replacement if needed. If you get a good grade, its a very classy look when finished correctly. I've taken to decorating the hamshack with framed vintage photos and QSL cards, and feel much less guilty driving a nail into the plywood as opposed to sheet-rock.

4) RF Feeds, if balanced, use nicely finished wooden "tracks" with ceramic standoffs for the feed. Overhead rather than wall mounted feed is more flexible. If coax, same concept, ceiling mounted feed, with a "star" arrangement to feed each station.

5) Natural light, accept no substitute. Nothing like a large peak-a-boo window to look out of, helps to relate the WX conditions to other stations, and makes you feel less like you are living in a cave. W2KBW had a delightful station, with a large window overlooking his backyard and pond, looked like a radio studio.

6) Noise, unless you are alone, its nice to have some soft of sound insulation, door, or other method of privacy.

7) Comfy and spacious couch, for those light night QSOs, and when the YL puts you in the doghouse for your latest hamfest purchases.

8) Almost as important as the radios, a heavy duty 807 cooler, with ice dispenser, for when your radio buddies stop by!


(http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/3839/radio/boysign.gif)

   "   No florescent lights, they make noise, incandescent all the way ""

I'd better amplify... the florescents are only on when i'm not opperating... they is noisy ... The small photo floods are great for spotlighting, or for difused lighting when they are aimed at something reflective.... F.C. Bradleys trick of using mic stands for photo lamps is gud 2 ........ klc

Blue Curtains..... you must try the blue curtains  ;D

 Check'm out here  (http://amfone.net/Gallery2/v/stations/wd8bil-1/AM+Station.jpg.html)

All of the above and add a small dry fire exstingwisher just in case your latest project doesn't pass the smoke test!!


Steve,
WA2TTP

got 1 of the fire extinguishers..... the only problem w/ the dry chemicals, is that the stuff is corrosive... still, its better than having ur Junkston 500 burn up. deionied H₂O to pour over the electronics after the fire is put out helps out a.  A CO₂ extinguisher is the way to go..   Cant get Halon any more......  klc

On a more serious note then my last reply.


I agree, window near the rigs. It is important to gaze out of them while pondering the next thought in your buzzard transmission. I would not put them near the benches

Industrial carpet. Mine has lasted 14+ years. Dropped screws and small unobtaniums don't go to far at all

Several permanent chases to the outside for antenna wire

Master breaker and some outlets on the light switch. When I come in and flip the light switch  on comes the desk lamp, the 756, the 2 meter rig and the A/C if summer.

More outlets. I thought I put in way to many when we built the house. HAH. I wish I had put in 2X as much.

Even more outlets

Agree with Bruce on the sheet rock. I used it and wish I had not.

Keep RF and Audio runs seperated as much as possible. I just rectified a problem with RF into the compressor by a simple re-route of the cables.
This seems like a no-brainer but in the excitment of getting the new digs going we sometimes overlook a wayward wire.

Here's my 2 cents:

• Always have a CO2 fire extinguisher. You can sometimes get 2.5 lb units that aren't allowed in commercial service anymore, but which are fine for the shack. Check you local fire equipment dealers: they often have retired extinguishers that were removed from buildings being upgraded to sprinklers, and sometimes they're free for the asking.
• Be sure all your outlets are wired as "split twenty" feeds. This means that you'll be able to draw 40 amps from each outlet pair, and it saves a lot on wire.
• Pay a lot of attention to ventillation: it's the most often overlooked aspect of shack layout. If you don't have ductwork in the space now, get a professional to appraise the layout and measure the airflow.
• Install messenger lights so that the XYL and/or kids can alert you to external events. YMMV, but this is the only thing that ever worked for me, since I found intercoms to be too intrusive.

HTH

73, Bill

I brought an air line up from the garage using black iron and stubbed it out in a nice wall box, hung a regulator, and put on about 35 feet of 1/4" goodyear speedaire hose. Great for blowing dust out of equipment.

Bill, what do you mean "split twenty feeds"? You would still have to bring over two runs of 12/2 anyway.

splitting outlets is a pita I put a quad box every 3 feet under my main bench. I should have done every 2 feet
You could do two services and one to each outlet but I never popped a breaker having it all hang off 1 service. You never have everything on at once. Big power 240v use #6 to the main panel.

What! It takes years to build up the proper noxious combination from spilled beers, electrocuted mice, blown electrolytics, smoked selenium, lost cigar buts, cracked jars of pickled eggplant, human emissions including sweat and other bodily discharges, broken off bits of sausage and peppers, forgotten pizza crusts, and you want to ventilate it.....

By the time you are done it will smell just like a Radio Shack
(http://www.greenmtmall.com/RADIOSHACK.jpg)

You want odors.... we have cell phones

Quote from: W1AC on Today at 14:13:29
Here's my 2 cents:


By the time you are done it will smell just like a Radio Shack   "

Ya can always burn some bake light ......  klc

Re "Split 20 feed"  You can run this with a single 12/3 with ground.  Black to phase A, red to phase B, white to neutral, and bare to ground.  You only need one 12 ga neutral because A and B are 180 degrees out of phase, hence all the neutral will see is 20A at any instant.

Lots of mentions about lighting - I like the idea of a light under the workbench, I can never see under there.  I do that on the equipment table when I have a shelf... I use those 'rope' lights under the upper shelf, throws a nice wash of light on the front of the radios below - makes it easy to see the controls when the shelf above would block room lighting.  Block the light from shining in your face with a 1.5" facing on the shelf, tucking the rope in the corner of the facing and the shelf.  If you want to make it total 'mood' lighting, run the rope lights on a small variac.

Have fun!   73, Bill  N2BC

   "So who's got 3 phase in their house? "


Not to many people that I know of...   The confusion between split phase, two phase and three phase can be confusein'.... ..    klc


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Split_phase

Not 3 phase at all.  Standard 240V residential service.

Mack,

Since the center tap of the pole transformer secondary is grounded, the two ends of the secondary show opposite phases with respect to ground. So long as the black and red wires are connected to opposite phases at the house distribution panel, this allows 4 plug outlets to be wired with one duplex receptacle on the "Black" phase, and the other on the "Red" phase, so that the neutral (usually white) wire only carries the difference current between the black and red wires.

The same plan is followed throughout your home: if the installation was done correctly, the loads will balance and there will be minimal current in the neutral wire between the pole and your home. The whole idea is to limit current in the neutral wire: if only one phase was available for both "hot" wires from the pole, the neutral would have to have twice the ampacity of either "hot" lead.

HTH.

73, Bill

I always try to learn something new every day, and now that it's 11:45pm, I'm all set for the next 15 minutes.

Thanks guys  :P

Mack,

You are, of course, correct, only one transformer on the pole means only one phase in the house: yes, we use single-phase power. However, the two hot leads from the pole are 180 degrees apart: if they were in phase, there'd be no voltage difference between them and no current flow.

The point is that, since the CT of the pole pig is grounded, the Neutral is always connected to ground. This is to make a 120 volt toaster work: the EMF from one of the hot leads to ground is ~120 volts.

The reason we balance the loads is because the neutral wire coming in from the pole is the same size as the hot connectors. That means that in order to prevent overloading the neutral, we have to find a way to keep the current below it's maximum rating when the home draws more than either hot lead can provide by itself, and to do that, we put an equal number of outlets and/or lights on each half of the pole transformer's secondary. That way, when (for example) the porch light is on and drawing current, if we turn on the kitchen light and the dining room light and the TV set, the neutral current will, on average, go down instead of up.

Of course, nobody goes around turning on lights just to manage their neutral current: that's the electrician's job. As I said, a proper installation will be set up so that the neutral will never have to carry more than the current in either hot wire, i.e., so that the loads are, effectively, in series across the 240 volt secondary of the pole transformer, which means the neutral only carries the difference between the two sides.

I'm sure I'm being as clear as mud. Trust me, I know it sounds weird, but it works. The whole point I was making vis-a-vis shack wiring is that you can use 12-3 to provide 40 amps to a pair of receptacles, instead of needing two separate 12-2 runs or an expensive length of 12-4.

I hope I've provided more light than smoke.

73, Bill W1AC

I've set up a number of labs including my shack and every time I put a bench against a wall I learned to hate it. Far better to have the small end against the wall so you can get behind the equipment.

1: Seperate building with 220, water, sewer, heat, air conditioning and a dehumidifier.
2: LOTS of light when you need it, ability to have less light when you don't.
3: A bathroom. (Wife won't let me put one out here. Says she'll never see me again)
4: A cat. Good company, warm lap in the winter and no mice in behind rack transmitters.
5: Beer frig.
6: Ceiling fan - Helps to circulate the air - makes building more comfortable.
7: Intercom or message lights. I have intercom - I would ignore a light or just not see it.
8: Lots of outlets. (I need to add more)
9: Master kill switch. Most of the stuff here is on one.
10: A bigger building
11: fire extinguisher

I have all but #3 and wish for #10. It seems like your collection of radios, parts and service equipment will fill all the available space and leave you wishing for more. Another good thing about the cat; I like my cat. I would not like to see him get killed by any HV or 120 that could be left exposed. I figure if I make things safe enough that I don't have to worry about him reaching into a rig or enclosure with the voltage on, I have it pretty well sealed up so I can't stick my fingers in there either. By watching out for him I also protect myself.

Good ideas and a good discussion!

>1: Seperate building with 220, water, sewer, heat, air conditioning and a dehumidifier.
>3: A bathroom. (Wife won't let me put one out here. Says she'll never see me again)
>10: A bigger building

Hey, you mean a seperate house for a hobby? It was difficult enough to get one house here!

I'd hate to walk or shovel the inevitable snow. Or be too far from the yl. I'd personally stick to the shack in the basement.

Still, lots of good suggestions. As the thread tails off, I'll compile a list for myself, and for the website. Perhaps I'll even post the occasional photo of the work on the room. I've got other projects in my new home, so I think this lab construction will be a little limited. I will be needing high current 120 for the BC-610.

Thanks all.

Dave Goncalves
W1EUJ

Whatever you do David, make sure you can hear the receiver from the 'fridge and bathroom. You'll be all set to handle the calls of nature without missing that all important 'ol buzzard goin on !

You know how some resturants have speakers in the bathroom? I think I'll do the same. Good suggestion:

- Audio system covering the food input and output locations

 I'll listen to you on the outside speaker.   klc

"And will be listening in the crapper room speaker"........

Or get yourself a wireless mic with IFB and you can continue to participate in the QSO while on the crapper. How sweet is that?

Wall-mounted boom mic, right next to the can. That's dedication!

Didn't broadcast radio start in hotel bathrooms draped with velvet?

Better than having a Mason jar next to the mic, or at least - easier.  ;)

I'm still stripping paint on my shack, hoping to beat winter wx in time to complete the paint job.  So far, dry scraping, an infra-red heat gadget, pressure washer and chemical stripper.  No matter what, a slow-going PITA to remove 75 years of old paint.

that could be extreemly nasty if one mistook the "mason jar" for their cup of coffee (or other favorite beverage) while making an
"Old buzzard"!! :o :o

Watch out for the lead in that paint!

I'm not too crazed about the wireless mike in the can idea. Although it COULD lead to hilarious frivolity in the #2 blastage dept.  :P

Don't be like me and put your operating position where water can get to it from overhead plumbing.  In my case, see: http://amfone.net/Amforum/index.php?topic=11985.0
My fault for not doing my homework on my plumbing.

Operation from in the can may create a new type of operating.

Instead of operation portable, one would be operating potable :o :o

...just finished moving my stuff, down the hall...ceiling fan, large windows, and walls/ceiling painted bright white. best thing for light reflection. dont forget wiring for grounds, counterpoises, etc...tim...sk..

I have a Radio Shack baby monitor I bought when my dad was sick and bed ridden
so that mom could hear him from the kitchen. After he died I brought it home.
It sat in a box for several years until I ran across it again and had the bright
idea to put the transmitter in the shack. It's on 49 MHz and covers the property
really well. I've since found another one at a ham fest so I have 2 receivers,
I have one in the little workshop off the display room
http://radioheaven.homestead.com/minishop.html
 and one in the garage workshop.
My wife knows if she needs me she just call to me near the office/shack
and I'll hear her if I'm in either work shop.

Keep in mind that if you do use one of these, the mics are VERY sensitive,
they'll pick up several rooms away. My monitor transmitter in on a switched outlet
strip that's only on when I want i on, don't want some neighbor with a scanner
listening to everything that goes on it the house... hi hi

73, Ron

...baby monitors are the best...i've used them fer years...the receiving one is portable, using a 9v battery...has a LED  bar s-meter, so it can been seen from a distance...started using it so i would'nt miss 6 metre openings...tx in the shack, portable in the werkshop...sk..

John, K1DEU has some info on his website than shows how to use a cordless telephone for two way comms with the station. Use the 900, 2400 or 5800 spread spectrum models and you don't need to worry about your neighbors listening in. Those 49 MHz FM units can be heard miles away, in some cases. Or so I've read.... ;)

The wireless phone we use has spred spectrum and an operating  F around 2 Ghz.. push a button in intercom mode and she starts to a beepin' 

living in the city years back, I listened in to several different households on the 49 Mc "baby band"

Back in the early 80's I copied a phone call from someone in Va on the 160m band. This blew my mind ---


    klc